Living Off the Land? - NOT!

[bigpaul]

(1 October 2013, 18:21)Oimccoy Wrote:

(1 October 2013, 18:14)bigpaul Wrote: dosent living off the land INCLUDE farming/growing?

Im not saying the attitude of hunter gathering is prevalent here but it is prevalent across many preppers - and without wanting to create an argument the posts on the sub forum for food production and livestock are vastly outnumbered by the posts for storing shop bought food which is only a stop gap measure for people of average income

the perceived wisdom is that the stored food, usually 12-18months worth,is to last us whilst we are growing fresh food and raising animals. hunting, trapping and foraging can go along with this but it is only to supplement our stored food-not to replace it.

[Skean Dhude]

Never really thought about the definitions but to me living off the land is a balance between growing your food on the land, keeping animals and hunting and foraging around.

[CharlesHarris]

When I took some anthropology courses many years ago, hunter-gathers were discussed separately from agrarian farmers and herdsmen. My understanding is that "living off the land" in popular survival literature, is the first group, whereas, the Hopi and Pima Indians of the US southwest would the the second catagory, and the Sami of Finland or Masai in South Africa the latter.

[Skean Dhude]

Well, that explains the misunderstanding there is no clear definition.

I put a stake in the ground with my statement for my understanding of what living off the land means.

[Timelord]

"Living off the land" is a phrase used to define living from what nature provides in the landscape and is not intended to be used for where mankind artificially modifies the land in a farming sense. There will always be a slight crossover where "hunter gatherers" have modified their local habitat, for example by planting berry bushes of edible plants in a suitable environment locally or where they build fish traps in a river or keeping a few small animals as a food source - this is transition behaviour to an agrarian lifestyle. Staying in one spot and seasonally growing your own food is a "farming activity" and is not living off the land, otherwise we could all claim to be indirectly living off the land and the phrase would have no real point. Happy digging.. TL.

[Timelord]

"Living off the land" is different to "Working the land".

[Highlander]

(2 October 2013, 13:58)Timelord Wrote: "Living off the land" is different to "Working the land".

Sorry TL,.. but I dont agree, anyone who finds themselves with nothing and can find a meal off any land, be it farm land or wilderness,...is still living off the land

someone living off the land in the middle of Alaska is to a certain degree `working the land`, he will set up traps, make fish baskets harvest fruit, and gather and make different items etc

Just like a farmer works his land, albeit on a smaller scale

[Scythe13]

I'm glad we have a definition war going on here haha.

Anyway....moving on.

We all live on land. No aquatic preppers on the forum I assume? Right, so, anyway....It's good to know what natural resources are available and how much you would need if you were to survive 100% off what nature provides. It's a good job we're all hoarding seeds, right?

As BP has said, we have our tins as a way to buy time until our seeds and the alike, are fully grown. However, having an understanding of hunting and the alike, is an awesome way to help those tins last longer, as is growing your own food with what little space we already have, e.g. gardening.

If anyone wants to live off the land, work the land, pillage the land, or whatever, that's their call. As for me and mine, we plan on taking just enough from nature to help us along, without damaging what we may need to help us out next year. While also growing what we can and enjoying that too.

Thanks for the post CH. Good to get an idea of quantities and the practical side of it all.

[Timelord]

(2 October 2013, 20:58)Highlander Wrote:

(2 October 2013, 13:58)Timelord Wrote: "Living off the land" is different to "Working the land".

Sorry TL,.. but I dont agree, anyone who finds themselves with nothing and can find a meal off any land, be it farm land or wilderness,...is still living off the land

someone living off the land in the middle of Alaska is to a certain degree `working the land`, he will set up traps, make fish baskets harvest fruit, and gather and make different items etc

Just like a farmer works his land, albeit on a smaller scale

In this case "living off the land" means nothing because then we are all living off the land!
In an expedient sense, as for a prepper, then if you find a meal on any type of land that you have not "worked" yourself or even from a deserted house, then that can be regarded as living off the land in a temporary sense. Setting up traps, fishbaskets fruit harvesting etc is living off the land in a hunter gatherer up to transition state before farming. Once you get into actually breaking the ground surface to systematically "work the land", then that is "working the land" and is by definition different to what the term "living off the land" is meant to encompass.
In academic and historical studies, the term "working the land" is used when the ground itself is artificially modified in a systematic way to benefit food cultivation. This does not include planting a few bushes or trapping fish with a stick built enclosure.. Likewise, hunter gatherers, then or now, are regarded as "living off the land". Farmers are regarded as "working the land".

[Timelord]

It is no problem. I do not post these clarifications to be pedantic. I post them so that any discussion involving these points can be undertaken in a way where we all understand what we are actually talking about in relation to our different viewpoints, otherwise the discussion can go round and round without realising any common understanding. It helps to have a common reference point/baseline/datum to work from. I am always happy to be corrected and learn new things. Regards, TL.