UK sinks into moral decay

[bigpaul]

(4 January 2013, 16:56)BeardyMan Wrote: I don't think many people will to be honest. Imagine being born and living in a city your whole life - you're not just going to up sticks and bugger off, on foot, into the great unknown. You'd take your chances in the area you know well.

In all honesty i'm not entirely sure now that being in a city would be all bad. Lots of resources (stuff in shops / offices / peoples houses), lots of secure places to shelter, lots of people to eat should the need arise.

and lots of people just as desperate as you, who wont hesitate to do you harm and take all your stuff. no thanks, i'll stay out in the countryside. i've have lived in a city and i know what the human animal is capable of and it isnt pretty.

[BeardyMan]

(4 January 2013, 17:01)bigpaul Wrote:

(4 January 2013, 16:56)BeardyMan Wrote: I don't think many people will to be honest. Imagine being born and living in a city your whole life - you're not just going to up sticks and bugger off, on foot, into the great unknown. You'd take your chances in the area you know well.

In all honesty i'm not entirely sure now that being in a city would be all bad. Lots of resources (stuff in shops / offices / peoples houses), lots of secure places to shelter, lots of people to eat should the need arise.

and lots of people just as desperate as you, who wont hesitate to do you harm and take all your stuff. no thanks, i'll stay out in the countryside. i've have lived in a city and i know what the human animal is capable of and it isnt pretty.

You would have to be the aggressor. Countryside would be a more peaceful existence. I think a small village would probably be the best bet

[Mortblanc]

I read the atrticle, was not impressed.

Each and every generation has been going to hell in a bucket since "Chedder Man" asked his kid to take the trash out of the cave and the kid refused, smarted off and stormed out of the cave screaming he hated his Dad.

The very kids spoken about in this article had grandparents who had the same issues in the 1960s. I remember, I was one of them.

As for generalizing this to all city dwellers, that is a streach. As well as all the speculation about the actions of people in the cities SHTF.

Your cities in England have been in their present locations for how long?

And for what reason were they founded? Is that reason still a valid use?

And when they were stricken by plague did they dissapear?

When they were burned to the ground did they dissapear?

And when they were bombed to ruins did they dissapear?

If you want to know what will happen SHTF just look to your own history. Anything that you can imagine as a SHTF senerio, short of a nuke explosion (and the overnight distruction of Covertry comes close to that senerio), has already happened at one time or another. Your cities rose again and your people, even the city dwellers (sheeple in your language), endured.

[Scythe13]

(4 January 2013, 21:12)Mortblanc Wrote: I read the atrticle, was not impressed.

Each and every generation has been going to hell in a bucket since "Chedder Man" asked his kid to take the trash out of the cave and the kid refused, smarted off and stormed out of the cave screaming he hated his Dad.

The very kids spoken about in this article had grandparents who had the same issues in the 1960s. I remember, I was one of them.

As for generalizing this to all city dwellers, that is a streach. As well as all the speculation about the actions of people in the cities SHTF.

Your cities in England have been in their present locations for how long?

And for what reason were they founded? Is that reason still a valid use?

And when they were stricken by plague did they dissapear?

When they were burned to the ground did they dissapear?

And when they were bombed to ruins did they dissapear?

If you want to know what will happen SHTF just look to your own history. Anything that you can imagine as a SHTF senerio, short of a nuke explosion (and the overnight distruction of Covertry comes close to that senerio), has already happened at one time or another. Your cities rose again and your people, even the city dwellers (sheeple in your language), endured.

I agree with this to an quite an extent. It all depends on the disaster and how long it lasts.

Many won't be able to cope. But there will be quite a few that can.

[bigpaul]

depends on the scenario, if there was no oil or no access to oil supplies then that would stop food being delivered to the shops, once all stocks are consumed the city dwellers would start dying of starvation or violence or both.

[BDG]

Lack of oil is the one that would be the tipping point I think too, as in 'Retrieved From the Future'.

[bigpaul]

(5 January 2013, 13:13)BDG Wrote: Lack of oil is the one that would be the tipping point I think too, as in 'Retrieved From the Future'.

lack of oil would propel us into a whole different lifestyle.

[Mortblanc]

The change of "lifestyles" and the success of that change would be dependent on if the shutoff of oil was gradual or instantanious.

We are not just talking about delivery of the 3 day food supply, but also of the planting of next year's crops, importation of foods, long term storage......

I still remember hearing my G-Grandfather, born in 1865, talking about being a teenager before he saw his first orange on a trip to the city. They would not make it into his part of the woods before they spoiled.

Gradual shutoff will cause a reversion to past methods of acceptance of new technology with a slow shift in priorities of the lifestyle.

Instant shutoff would result in the panic and possible rioting that accompanies all sudden shortages. If you want to see middle class suburbanites turn into a mob stop the flow of gas from the pumps here in a U.S. city. There will be riots and beating of linebreakers by people that are normally upstanding citizens. Our auto oriented culture is almost freakish.

I had a friend from GB over here this fall and we went to the local firing range. Her biggist shock of the trip was when they changed targets everyone got in their vehicles and drove to the 100 yard line!

I have know of instances here when people used 10 gallons of gas to fetch home 11 gallons of gas.

These are the same people everyone over here worries about becomming a "roving horde of looters". They will not walk to the corner store to fetch food, they sure are not going to walk 30 miles into the boonies to snag my freeze-dried munchies.

[bigpaul]

(5 January 2013, 18:00)Mortblanc Wrote: These are the same people everyone over here worries about becomming a "roving horde of looters". They will not walk to the corner store to fetch food, they sure are not going to walk 30 miles into the boonies to snag my freeze-dried munchies.

if they havent stocked up on road fuel then they arent going to get very far out of a city, in this country most people usually almost run their tanks dry before they fill up again, any shortages of fuel supply and those same peoples vehicles will be dry-----in which case they arent "roving" ANYWHERE!!

---

the nearest cities to me are 30 and 40 miles away and we have some very wild country(Dartmoor) in between them and us, i know there are some fit people amongst us but your average British sheeple over 40 is very UNfit,and dosent walk any further than the nearest pub or take away, so i dont think i've got a lot to worry about.

[BDG]

Also you must remember how a group will move. While I am under 40 and would consider myself in decent shape, many under 40 are in crap shape. If I were part of a group moving over land, I would either be navigating and leading or brining up the rear, motivating and pushing the stragglers on.

Having took people out walking in the past, I can say take an average cross section of people late teens and early 20's and walk them along a footpath - within a mile they are going to be 300 yards apart down to the speed they can walk at.

Take them over mixed ground it it would turn into a mess very quickly.

If you can get yourself 600 yards from a road and with your dwelling out of site so that maybe some one on top of the next valley can see it but you hide your activity, no one is coming visiting.