Heaven Help Us

[Lightspeed]

Brilliant and inspired post Mortblanc

You made me smile

[CharlesHarris]

Mortblanc,

Your insightful comments are spot-on and much appreciated. You would be welcome i my AO.

[Tartar Horde]

"Rather than asking if you would take a poor looser, deranged, God believing moron of a Christian into your group to burden you and cause all sorts of problems, Why not ask why a well organized, successful, well equipped group of Christians would wish to take a non-believer into THEIR group"
But if you profess the true Christian faith Mort, wouldn't you be expected to to show mercy to strangers, or do I have to start quoting scripture?

"After all, the non-believer is never going to fit in"
If I didn't know that remark came from a Christian i would have assumed it was from a muslim extremist.

[Scythe13]

Technically the official definition of a church is a meeting of people under a single banner, e.g. a football (soccer for our colonial members) stadium is probably the biggest church in any city. The way it is viewed is more like a religion too.

However, in regards to religion occuring post SHTF...people will be looking for answers. The what, why, when, how, and who, are going to be asked, and those with answers (whether correct, incorrect, or morphed versions of the truth) will be looked to. Think of these people as being the focal point to bring answers to the questions of the lost and confused many.

Some of the answers will be under a religious view point, e.g. God is punishing us. Others will be more 'earthly' in their response, e.g. Nature is Punishing us. Others will be scientific, e.g. We consumed the resources like locust, we only have ourselves to blame.

Whatever happens, many will need a higher cause or reasoning to explain it all. People will accept what they want to believe, whether it's religion or science, or a bit of both.

WTSHTF, only those mature enough in their beliefs (whether religious or non-religious) and secure enough with themselves, will be able to cohabit and get on with daily life.

The religious elements forcing their religion on other people will be chastised, just the same as those without a religious belief will be chastised for forcing their non-belief on other people. Regardless of your religious opinions or atheistic views, or anything inbetween, if you are unable to get along with other people, as TH does hint at it will be the dominant belief that will probably have a final say.

Having said that, a group of any religious view should be no more or less accepting than any other. Granted TH recognises the Christian view to show mercy to strangers (love thy neighbour, Mark 12 I think), but they also have an obligation to look after their own family and those already under their protection.

Providing the people in a group are not religious zealots, are mature adults and able to have conversation without it leading to arguments, and understand how to use the words "I don't think we'll ever agree, and I'm not really in the mood to discuss this. If I want to chat about this topic, I'll let you know. For now, let's just leave it." and the other person is okay to accept that. Then there will be no problems at all for anyone.

If the view of "Oh you're one of those religious nutters...." or "I Allah hates you people because of your sins..." or anything like that...that's when serious issues arise.

I think it comes down to being a mature adult and being able to accept that not all people are the same. Accept there are differences, and getting on with the job.

[bigpaul]

yet another good reason for going lone wolf

[MaryN]

Lovely thought, Scythe, and just how many mature people do you actually know now, never mind in the aftermath of SHTF?

[Scythe13]

Personally, I'm a Christian. I am married to an atheist, and I have never brought up the question of faith with her. I get along with BP, a pagan, and along with some very good friends of mine that joke about my religious belief. I have never forced my faith on anyone on the forum, have I? Many of my friends are Muslim, and we debate religion. I will phone them and ask their views, just as they phone me and ask my council on other matters.

My whole life has been spent around Christianity, during my first year at university (studied philosophy for a year, took a year out, then came back to study business management) I used to debate with many people from many faiths and view points, and we would do so even after the lectures were over, in the student's union. Later on I would go to the gym with friends, then maybe boxing or MMA. One of my favourite guys to box with was a massive guy called Mohammed (any guesses at his religion). Then we'd just chat for a while about life, lectures, and the like, without a mention of either his faith or mine.

The trick to having groups of friends that you get along with, hang out with loads of different kinds of people, and see which ones you gel with best. I know at least 5 Muslims that would die for me, and that I would die for too. Same with Atheists...well, much more than 5 anyway.

Even though I'm coming up to 30, I hang out with very mature people. They are out there, it's just hard work finding them haha.

[Mortblanc]

(18 May 2014, 21:44)Tartar Horde Wrote: "Rather than asking if you would take a poor looser, deranged, God believing moron of a Christian into your group to burden you and cause all sorts of problems, Why not ask why a well organized, successful, well equipped group of Christians would wish to take a non-believer into THEIR group"
But if you profess the true Christian faith Mort, wouldn't you be expected to to show mercy to strangers, or do I have to start quoting scripture?

"After all, the non-believer is never going to fit in"
If I didn't know that remark came from a Christian i would have assumed it was from a muslim extremist.

Seems this is the invitation for the start of a religious argument, as always happens with this type thread. Eventually it becomes aggression and defense, not live and let live.

I have quoted no scripture, made no attempt to teach doctrine or argue for supremacy of one view over another.

It would appear that I am fighting a prejudicial structure as ingrained and stereotypical as any racism or ethic disparity. Bigotry at its finest.

The "Unbeliever" has a stereotypical view of any religious person based on a few scriptures they have heard through the years, a few knocks at the door on Saturday morning, of a few news clips.

What I have tried to do is offer a view of a group of believers, any believers, as an already functioning and structured organization.

I have also linked the activity of prepping with the foundation of a form of religion in its own right.

Amazing that you picked up on the fear of an organized, selective, Christian movement and the mistaken principle that a Christian MUST be an all enduring wimp, but not the direct development of prepping as a religion.

[bigpaul]

what I fail to understand is why a CULT that started in the middle east has anything to do with a small island jutting out into the Atlantic Ocean? another "benefit" of the ancient Romans I suppose, we had our own belief system before the Christians turned up and nicked all our Holy sites and Holy days. did you ever wonder why a churchyard always has a YEW tree in it, its because the church is built over a previously Pagan Holy site.

[Barneyboy]

whats wrong with pagan ,its as good as any other