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Rethinking the best home defense weapons: a look at the .22
1 December 2015, 13:08,
#41
RE: Rethinking the best home defense weapons: a look at the .22
MIDMO Very nicely done, is it a R10/22 with a choate stock?, it looks so similar to what I had in Kansas
Preppers willingly embrace the benefits of modern technology, but we aint daft enough to rely upon it.
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1 December 2015, 13:25,
#42
RE: Rethinking the best home defense weapons: a look at the .22
It started life as a bog standard 10/22 beech stock that I bought for £320 14 month's ago , it slowly morphed into what you see now , butler creek folder from Ebay for £75 posted(don't seem to be available new anymore) wanted a folder and not a telescopic for ultimate compactness , it has a target hammer for a better trigger pull , an extended/enlarged bolt handle for ease of use and I'm experimenting with my first ever red dot sight(cheap Hawke 1x30 for £18)may upgrade to something a little better soon as I do like the speed of target acquisition and the both eyes open aspect , tis great fun to shoot in action competitions but I think the dot lacks crispness and is a tad to big at range being 4 moa , just waiting on the postie to bring my back up sights which I will co witness with the red dot.....very quick and easy to refit the old stock/scope should I wish to go hunting(less threatening in appearance with the trad stock on)
Nothing is fool proof for a sufficiently talented fool!!!!
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1 December 2015, 13:42,
#43
RE: Rethinking the best home defense weapons: a look at the .22
Truly a great lil ole Carbine, ideal for the UK. Oh and I noticed the good quality ammo, I liked Blazer, Yellow Jacket and Stinger ammos when I had one to play with. If only we had slightly more sensible gun laws in the UK such as de-licencing 22 rimfire.
Preppers willingly embrace the benefits of modern technology, but we aint daft enough to rely upon it.
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1 December 2015, 22:36,
#44
RE: Rethinking the best home defense weapons: a look at the .22
One of my favorite blogs which I read regularly is "Straight Forward In A Crooked World" aka "Dark Arts for the Good Guys"

A worthwhile read applies to the .22 handgun, but everything there could be applied to a compact .22 semi-auto rifle as well.

http://straightforwardinacrookedworld.bl...istol.html

Condensing tidbits from the original post and appending the best learned comments from blog readers with law enforcement, inteligence or special operations experience yields a feast of food for thought:

“...I spent a week with a retired CIA spook ... paid, to give….training in useful skills that would aid me in ….my future endeavours….after a steak dinner…he went to pay the tab and was looking for… something…and in the process laid out a worn pocket holster with a small automatic… worn blued Walther TPH (German) and, having never seen one before I wanted to know more…..

He told me of a few misadventures….but,…his parting remark…stuck with me "If you are lucky enough to travel around the world armed and doing it mainly alone do yourself a favor always carry a .22 pistol, regardless of anything else you pack."

“…nights later sitting in the dark….getting ready to make a mad dash for the territory ahead…and, people with not-so-questionable intent well within my comfort space...which was down the stairs, I didn't think about wanting a rifle, or… one of my beloved 1911s. I remember longing for that .22. Not because I thought it superior…but,…due to the fact I should have had (a gun, ANY gun!) with me….

If you …compare ….the .22 long rifle to anything else…you …ask why are you… having the .... discussion. ... While some of us…are allowed to own, shoot, and carry a wide array of calibers, actions, and magazine capacity, (outside then US) others are not so fortunate. For example….handgun ownership for self defense in Mexico is… damn near impossible… there exists only one legal gun store (in the whole country!) and it sits on a military base in Mexico City….A household can…have one defensive arm…either a pistol or a revolver but, it has to be within the .22 to .380 scale...and you can only possess 200 rounds of ammo a year.

If I were an honest Mexican citizen and left with that choice I'd choose the .22. “Whoa!" you say… If you live in such a place…what do you think the availability of shooting ranges are? Hence some things need to be done covertly where a drive into the country side and back into the trees you can fetch (quality trigger time) without unwanted attention….for people…in …countries…with restrictions it's …easier to FIND .22 ammo on the pseudo black market without having to delve…into conversations with individuals your mother wouldn't approve of, let alone the Policia.

….(If) you had to be on the move through a varying landscape….for a few days with …unfriendlies about….(mostly) on foot, or catching the occasional mass transit system, or train, or negotiating a ride for the next twenty miles.....just getting out. There on your hip concealed in all of its glory is your beloved full size center-fire pistol and two fully loaded magazines.
The point to (having) two handguns…flexibility….. There are times….where suppressive fire is just good application. For …folks who work alone, far away and, outside of official channels there is a place for the .22 in your life…it can serve as a not so gentle reminder that incoming fire has the right of way to those who are actively shooting at you…

In a mobile pursuit….tires can be flattened from a distance. Traffic jams can be created BEHIND you thus assisting in your escape. Being pursued on a long and rural darkened road head lights can be shot out (don't misinterpret that as one bullet for one head lamp as if it were a steady and calm Olympic event)… I've never met a soul willing to pursue at a high rate of speed in near pitch black conditions. And while I've seen plenty of spare tires on vehicles I don't recall too many spare headlights.

What message would it say to….aggressors walking down the street if a shot rang out, then another and still another as street lights systematically were shot out…(Anyone) willing to not only embrace a fight but, to deliberately do it in the dark will give pause to most pursuers….that can be done without having to sacrifice your limited ammo availability to your primary center-fire handgun.

….two hundred .22 rounds can be squirreled away most anywhere, let alone fifty or a hundred…into a paper cup without having the bottom fall out….something else you have to remember about bullets….lowly .22 included… cause destruction when fired into living things… creating trauma that stops his onslaught is the general idea…five or six of those itty bitty rounds into the forehead or sternum cause repetitive systematic destruction...

….apply…to… bad man….Bone has been fragmented and broken, the body's primary control area has received substantial damage and things begin to shut down and not in some priority status way. The visual ability to target a victim has been either removed or compromised, not to mention the most basic ability to conceive, maintain, and rely upon any real thought process is gone....gone.

The attack breaks. Repetitive-Systematic-Destruction

(Skeptics) …play the trump card…".22's misfire...end of story"….There are no free lunches…when the fight for your life is on.
Clear the f…ing round…get back in the fight…nothing different about a misfired .22 and a stove piped 9mm. Both require you to disengage, (act)…and, re-engage.….Many…who don't ever favor the .22LR for defense work….it is never my first choice but…have to remember…amidst the "stopping power" business. Bullet holes of any caliber in the throat end a fight as do puncture wounds to the lungs especially multiple ones. Regardless if they come from a .22, a .45 Auto or a kitchen knife.

SELECTED READER COMMENTS:

Seabat said.... I obtained a Beretta Jaguar .22 ….years ago…..Mossad used them for jobs back in the 1960's. They were very happy with theirs….

Anonymous said... in the early 80's I was working at a gas station on the grave yard shift and…carried…a Colt Challenger….I got held up….put the entire mag into him. I remember hearing a cop say at the scene "I'm not eating italian for a while, that's a mess". Here I am.

Anonymous said...I retired in 1996 after twenty years in clandestine services seeing some of the tensest moments of the cold war before retiring…Your article is…spot on but…. I carried (primarily handguns) all over the world…the Walther TPH in .22 …popular…among fellow officers along with the .32 PP and Mauser HSc. …(Most) American shooters…never experienced…handgun regulations or covert work fail to understand that sometimes there simply aren't any choices to be had.….22LR, even in the old Soviet Bloc when the wall was up, is the easiest ammunition to locate without having black market contacts.
“…odd thing was the .22 was far more substantial in use on humans than on animals like dogs… folks…who have never shot anything other than paper fail to understand that neutralizing a threat means just that.attacker…gasping for air, on the floor from three or four shots to the chest,… threat has been neutralized…moot point if…alive or dead… It isn't the round that matters, it's the shooters mindset and ability that wins or loses.

Anonymous said... During my LEO days, I often felt the need to carry something a bit smaller than…my.. department…duty weapons….the average street thug was a coward looking for easy pickings. While not necessarily fatal, a gunshot requires a trip to a hospital where people ask embarrassing questions like, "who are & just how did you end up with 2 or 3 slugs in your hide?" …Police…ask the same questions in a rather more insistent fashion. With… small calibers, bullet placement is essential. A kneecap shot will anchor an assailant …you… stroll away at leisure. “Don't forget the femoral artery as a target…If…expecting heavy disagreement, of course I'd take the "Fat Lady" but otherwise, you don't want to alarm people. The Beretta Bobcat (or Tomcat) might be a good choice…remember that your target will seldom be more than 20 feet away.

Anonymous said... During my time as a LEO…involved in a few shootings including one should-have-been-simple arrest that turned into a 14 on 2 war…service weapon broke during the fight…pinned down with nothing but my Beretta .22…I had owned…since I was 12…very comfortable with it….The count for the lowly .22 that day was 3 on the ground and one with a toe tag. It saved my butt big time...

Carriedwithoutlovethetwenty-two...worked as a Blackwater contractor (before the fall out) and while most of the notoriety came from the Afghanistan and Iraq operations many of us worked all over the world….ALOT of operations in India, Western and Eastern Europe… I carried a Walther P22 on no less than five jobs overseas with two of those jobs it being my primary piece. (Nobody) was thrilled with the option which was either 22LR or .32 ACP due to in country restrictions… I'm not a lover of the .22 for personal protection work but, the author is right sometimes it's your only option…for most individuals who ride a desk, don't travel beyond meetings and vacation don't realize there is a whole other operational world out there…accepting limitations of life.

73 de KE4SKY
In
"Almost Heaven" West Virginia
USA
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1 December 2015, 22:56,
#45
RE: Rethinking the best home defense weapons: a look at the .22
a 22 is still better than a knife in a fight with more than 6 ft of space between combatants.
Preppers willingly embrace the benefits of modern technology, but we aint daft enough to rely upon it.
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25 January 2018, 20:07,
#46
RE: Rethinking the best home defense weapons: a look at the .22
When I first started shooting in the eighties, I mainly shot full bore police pistol (man size turning targets for those who have never had the pleasure), but to improve my groups on 25 yard static targets I used a Berreta model 76 22LR.

This gun I found out was used by israel’s mossad as an assassination weapon using sub sonic ammunition and a weakened spring for semi auto action, 10 rounds always did the trick.

Using a standard velocity or preferably a hollow point round, one hit would probably stop most intruders, two certainly would, and there’s another eight rounds waiting.

22LR is a viable defensive round in either a rifle or pistol, but with any weapon practice is required.
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25 January 2018, 20:22,
#47
RE: Rethinking the best home defense weapons: a look at the .22
Given the restrictions you have in the UK, a .22 rifle, or target pistol is a viable option.

I would prefer a larger caliber, of course, but it is a matter of dancing with the girl you brought...

Some related links:

http://www.guns.com/review/gel-test-22-l...hat-could/

http://www.brassfetcher.com/Handguns/22LR/22LR.html

http://www.wideopenspaces.com/22-long-ri...ive-round/

https://www.usacarry.com/forums/general-...t-gel.html

73 de KE4SKY
In
"Almost Heaven" West Virginia
USA
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26 January 2018, 01:06,
#48
RE: Rethinking the best home defense weapons: a look at the .22
Sorry, but I have shot and been shot at as well as hunted for long enough to not consider the 22lr a "viable round" for anything but the smallest game.

Yes it will kill.

No it will not kill reliably. That is the reason the Masad dumped the entire magazine into their victims.

Only time I would consider it was if it was the last damn thing in the house and that has not been the case since I was a kid.
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