11 February 2014, 17:47
11 February 2014, 17:52
whatever.
11 February 2014, 18:00
Lightspeed
RE: Snippets about the floods
Re living in a flood zone, I bet most of the folk on this site live on land that is reasonably certain to be above flooding. I bet that this is not by happy coincident.
I also bet that anyone new to prepping, but serious about it, who finds themselves in a flood prone are will be actively looking to get out of that situation as soon as they can.
Our home is around 2000 feet ASL, away from any historically flooded areas. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
LS
Best post on risk assessment and prior planning I've read this year, I live 289 feet above sea level and 10 miles from the coast to avoid tidal surges and tsunamis as well as riverine flooding.
As I have pointed out previously once upon a time the Posh, Cool, Trendy and Social climbing snobby thing to do was drive a BMW or Audi and if living in the GL area live in Chelsea / Westminster / Henley type places with posh riverside home and have a boat tied up at the end of the garden. But since the mid 90s many of those over paid social climbing twits now choose Landies and Rangies and choose to live at higher elevation in the rural parts of the home counties. Mean while going right back to the days of the Widening gyre forum those who came into our communities pretty soon realised the precarious state of their own positions. I remember Neil Mk 1 moving to Exeter on some hilltop, Neil Mk 3 move to a mountainside near Aberystwith, the three families that once lived in Swansea and Cardiff buggered off up the valleys. Coming forward we see HAL moving to a high ground lump of Scotland as did Highlander, as did Tarrel, one dude retired and moved from Swindon to the Devon moors, BP headed up hill from the coast to upland Devon. even a few I met from tother forum have all committed themselves to moving uphill ASAP. Even my crazy friend who lived on a converted coach as bought himself a Gite some place in the central Massiff of France and my old partner HT bought himself a tiny plot of land on the side of a mountain in northern Spain.
RE: Snippets about the floods
Re living in a flood zone, I bet most of the folk on this site live on land that is reasonably certain to be above flooding. I bet that this is not by happy coincident.
I also bet that anyone new to prepping, but serious about it, who finds themselves in a flood prone are will be actively looking to get out of that situation as soon as they can.
Our home is around 2000 feet ASL, away from any historically flooded areas. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
LS
Best post on risk assessment and prior planning I've read this year, I live 289 feet above sea level and 10 miles from the coast to avoid tidal surges and tsunamis as well as riverine flooding.
As I have pointed out previously once upon a time the Posh, Cool, Trendy and Social climbing snobby thing to do was drive a BMW or Audi and if living in the GL area live in Chelsea / Westminster / Henley type places with posh riverside home and have a boat tied up at the end of the garden. But since the mid 90s many of those over paid social climbing twits now choose Landies and Rangies and choose to live at higher elevation in the rural parts of the home counties. Mean while going right back to the days of the Widening gyre forum those who came into our communities pretty soon realised the precarious state of their own positions. I remember Neil Mk 1 moving to Exeter on some hilltop, Neil Mk 3 move to a mountainside near Aberystwith, the three families that once lived in Swansea and Cardiff buggered off up the valleys. Coming forward we see HAL moving to a high ground lump of Scotland as did Highlander, as did Tarrel, one dude retired and moved from Swindon to the Devon moors, BP headed up hill from the coast to upland Devon. even a few I met from tother forum have all committed themselves to moving uphill ASAP. Even my crazy friend who lived on a converted coach as bought himself a Gite some place in the central Massiff of France and my old partner HT bought himself a tiny plot of land on the side of a mountain in northern Spain.
11 February 2014, 19:19
HAH !!!! living on high ground is not always ideal either, just went to walk the dog for the first time since coming out of hospital and there is 2 inches of snow outside!!!!!
11 February 2014, 21:04
Ok - some random thoughts as I've been out all day.
Personal Situation - I don't own but live in 'tied accommodation', i.e. it comes with the job
4 bedroomed detached modern warm place. Village has been known to flood around 18 years ago but not since then. The local river - "the run" flows pretty well and it is kept in good condition.
I don't have the option to buy or rent elsewhere. Biggest danger is actually coastal flooding which caused grief locally a few months ago but nothing in my village.The flood situation is not getting better. If anything it is getting worse. someone commented about our tax money being spent on defences. Well why not? I know the prepper in me would say "serves yourself right --- you should have prepped". (I know BP would say "Amen to that sister" bit I'm not sure BP does Amens :-)
But you've gotta have a heart. The ruthlessness of some preppers makes me want to become a left wing Guardianista ("... shivers")
I'm not convinced about NR's diatribe against southerners but I guess we have to take it with as many grains of salt to swallow it. The truth is that at present there are certain parameters when it comes to spending money on flood defences.
1. Is it economically viable? For every £1 invested they look for £8 back. Cities come first
2. How many people would be affected? Cities come first.
3. Affect on business? Cities come first.
...... and there are other parameters all of which point to money being spent on cities. Now you may very well question those parameters (as NR does in his inimitable manner :-) but that is how it is. FWIW, we should copy the Dutch and just invest and reclaim the land. (The more conservative amongst you will cringe at the possible tax implications but that is the kind of public debate we need to have)
Which brings me on to the kind of responses that I have seen in the last 72 hours. Never have I seen such faffing about raised to the levels of an art form. All of these Gold, Silver and bronze resilience groupings together with civil servants and ministers are risk averse. They are interested in covering their arses, and wondering what others might think about the decisions. IMHO only two people are emerging from this with any credibility. The Secretary of State for Defence Philip Hammond who within 15 minutes of arriving and seeing for himself, ordered large scale troops in. The only other person who has acquitted himself well, (and it pains me immensely to say this) is David Cameron who has insisted that they "pull their bloody fingers out".
Sadly my experience of UK structures leads me to believe that there is something endemically wrong with us that prevents leadership emerging that will take a strong hand.
<musing...>
At least Mussolini made the trains run on time
<end musing>
Keep well - stay dry.
Oh BTW - these are great value and excellent quality
http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B006X...UTF8&psc=1
Personal Situation - I don't own but live in 'tied accommodation', i.e. it comes with the job
4 bedroomed detached modern warm place. Village has been known to flood around 18 years ago but not since then. The local river - "the run" flows pretty well and it is kept in good condition.
I don't have the option to buy or rent elsewhere. Biggest danger is actually coastal flooding which caused grief locally a few months ago but nothing in my village.The flood situation is not getting better. If anything it is getting worse. someone commented about our tax money being spent on defences. Well why not? I know the prepper in me would say "serves yourself right --- you should have prepped". (I know BP would say "Amen to that sister" bit I'm not sure BP does Amens :-)
But you've gotta have a heart. The ruthlessness of some preppers makes me want to become a left wing Guardianista ("... shivers")
I'm not convinced about NR's diatribe against southerners but I guess we have to take it with as many grains of salt to swallow it. The truth is that at present there are certain parameters when it comes to spending money on flood defences.
1. Is it economically viable? For every £1 invested they look for £8 back. Cities come first
2. How many people would be affected? Cities come first.
3. Affect on business? Cities come first.
...... and there are other parameters all of which point to money being spent on cities. Now you may very well question those parameters (as NR does in his inimitable manner :-) but that is how it is. FWIW, we should copy the Dutch and just invest and reclaim the land. (The more conservative amongst you will cringe at the possible tax implications but that is the kind of public debate we need to have)
Which brings me on to the kind of responses that I have seen in the last 72 hours. Never have I seen such faffing about raised to the levels of an art form. All of these Gold, Silver and bronze resilience groupings together with civil servants and ministers are risk averse. They are interested in covering their arses, and wondering what others might think about the decisions. IMHO only two people are emerging from this with any credibility. The Secretary of State for Defence Philip Hammond who within 15 minutes of arriving and seeing for himself, ordered large scale troops in. The only other person who has acquitted himself well, (and it pains me immensely to say this) is David Cameron who has insisted that they "pull their bloody fingers out".
Sadly my experience of UK structures leads me to believe that there is something endemically wrong with us that prevents leadership emerging that will take a strong hand.
<musing...>
At least Mussolini made the trains run on time
<end musing>
Keep well - stay dry.
Oh BTW - these are great value and excellent quality
http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B006X...UTF8&psc=1
11 February 2014, 21:37
Yes the level's of bureaucracy and ass covering in this country are unbelievable!
For example: China builds 6,000 miles of rail track in the time the UK only "debates" the merits of constructing 100 miles of high-speed rail line.
http://news.sky.com/story/1194709/china-...be-doubled
For example: China builds 6,000 miles of rail track in the time the UK only "debates" the merits of constructing 100 miles of high-speed rail line.
http://news.sky.com/story/1194709/china-...be-doubled
11 February 2014, 23:03
OMG!!! WHAT??!?! There's been flooding in the UK?!?!? Why did nobody tell me this?!?!?!
Okay, I will rant, no doubt, but before I do...If you have been effected by the flooding, AND WE HAVE MET, please let me know. We have a spare bedroom, warm clothes, and plenty of food. I'm happy to come and pick you up, especially if you're in the Somerset area. If you have been effected, my heart goes out for your and I could not imagine what it is like to lose everything the way you have.
Time for the rant.
I think about 75% or more of this isn't about prepping, but just opinions on buying houses, gloating about how high we live, and not understanding each other's situations and perspectives.
But you know what, let's bring this back to prepping and survivalism.
Okay, nobody buy a house on a flood plain, we've got that bit sorted. But what if you don't have an option? Well then figure a route out of the house if something were to happen, e.g. a bug out route for a flooding scenario. If we lived on a flood plain, we'd prep with a kayak or 2. Would this save our house? Nope. Would it save our animals? Some of them, yes. Would it put us into a safer position? Yes. Would it still suck to have our house ruined by flooding? Damn right! But we can always rebuild a house, not so easy with rebuilding lives though.
Do we, as preppers, need to make contingencies incase something like flooding was to happen? Of course. We would take reasonable precautions. Please note the word REASONABLE!!! If we lived on a flood plain, the wife would probably see my view of an 8 foot water shield as excessive. Having said that, we would have attracted a load of attention and would be inundated with people and the alike, in the event of a flood. In short, we'd be screwed, whether we had huge flood barriers. But then turn it around. No preps and we'd still be screwed. There are some situations that you cannot win. Levels of flooding that would surpass 'reasonable precautions' are just one example of the 'cannot win' style of situation.
If you live on a better elevation, don't think that gives you the moral high ground (no pun intended, but the irony is there). Farmers have, throughout history, favoured flood plains because of the richness of nutrients that are washed up with the sediment. Why do you think the cities were largely based around rivers? Because of transport and the richness of soil for food. So those 'idiots' on the flood plains are the ones putting food on your plate.
But if you live on a flood plain, you do not have the moral high ground to start bitching and being a negative Nancy. The situation may not have been favourable, and you may have been forced to live in that area. Maybe it was job or council that ordained that as your home, but just because you live there doesn't mean you can moan about it. If you took reasonable precaution, then that's cool. You tried your best. At least you have some kind of water raft, a couple of BOB's, and the wherewithal to move expensive furniture upstairs when you get a flood warning. Because these kinds of things would be reasonable precautions. If you're new to prepping or have not got the finances for these things, you have gone through a horrific experience, and probably still are, but at least you're alive. If you've survived it, you can easily learn a valuable lesson.
Granted, any kind of catastrophe will suck. Whether it's 5 feet of water on the Somerset levels, a rising River Thames, or a couple of inches of snow, for wherever NR lives. But there are some situations that just catch you out.
Instead of everyone bitching and moaning, regardless about whether they're effected or not, why not start acting in a more forum style manner, and start supporting one another? Make helpful suggestions? Offer assistance or aid? Instead of name calling and cursing one region, e.g. London, because they have more money than you, or just because you don't like the area and are thus ignorant to it. The same goes with situations that effect people, either you're going through it, or you're ignorant of their situation. Until you ARE that person, you can never truly understand their plight. So why make unhelpful comments time and again? It's been embarrassing hearing people of above average intelligence completely lose their ability to empathise and assist their fellow human beings, let alone their fellow preppers!
Here's an idea, when an earthquake devastates the home you live in and ruins your life, everyone unaffected by it will be entitled to just rip into you for where you live and then gloat about how secure they are. Is that cool? What about a megastorm smashing your home to bits? When that happens, and you turn to people that are meant to be comrades in arms about wanting to learn to survive, how would you feel if they just turned round and were knobs to you? Really uncool behaviour!
Seriously, bickering and the alike not only makes you look silly, but it entirely defeats the idea of trying to learn and develop our preps together!
This is not a gloating game.
This is not a name calling forum.
This is not a North vs South divide forum.
THIS IS A PREPPING FORUM WHERE PEOPLE ARE MEANT TO HELP ONE ANOTHER SURVIVE!!!
If the bitching is what happens when a few of our number are effected, then WTSHTF for us all, I truly feel sorry for us.
Instead of gloating, why not offer aid? Instead of bitching that stuff's going wrong? Get your bags ready to bug out, and start moving furniture upstairs. Trip your fuse box. Board up your walls, air bricks, and the alike. Go crazy with sandbags and volumes of silicone sealant stuff! Call friends and family for help.
We are entitled to help ourselves and our fellow humans, whether it's providing food, blankets, or something like that, or if it's actually going down there and lending a helping hand. Alternatively raise money for charity, open up a spare bedroom to a friend, or whatever.
But please let's just keep this about prepping and the alike. No point being A-Holes to people whom have already been through hell and high water (pun intended there....sorry if it offended anyone).
Okay, I will rant, no doubt, but before I do...If you have been effected by the flooding, AND WE HAVE MET, please let me know. We have a spare bedroom, warm clothes, and plenty of food. I'm happy to come and pick you up, especially if you're in the Somerset area. If you have been effected, my heart goes out for your and I could not imagine what it is like to lose everything the way you have.
Time for the rant.
I think about 75% or more of this isn't about prepping, but just opinions on buying houses, gloating about how high we live, and not understanding each other's situations and perspectives.
But you know what, let's bring this back to prepping and survivalism.
Okay, nobody buy a house on a flood plain, we've got that bit sorted. But what if you don't have an option? Well then figure a route out of the house if something were to happen, e.g. a bug out route for a flooding scenario. If we lived on a flood plain, we'd prep with a kayak or 2. Would this save our house? Nope. Would it save our animals? Some of them, yes. Would it put us into a safer position? Yes. Would it still suck to have our house ruined by flooding? Damn right! But we can always rebuild a house, not so easy with rebuilding lives though.
Do we, as preppers, need to make contingencies incase something like flooding was to happen? Of course. We would take reasonable precautions. Please note the word REASONABLE!!! If we lived on a flood plain, the wife would probably see my view of an 8 foot water shield as excessive. Having said that, we would have attracted a load of attention and would be inundated with people and the alike, in the event of a flood. In short, we'd be screwed, whether we had huge flood barriers. But then turn it around. No preps and we'd still be screwed. There are some situations that you cannot win. Levels of flooding that would surpass 'reasonable precautions' are just one example of the 'cannot win' style of situation.
If you live on a better elevation, don't think that gives you the moral high ground (no pun intended, but the irony is there). Farmers have, throughout history, favoured flood plains because of the richness of nutrients that are washed up with the sediment. Why do you think the cities were largely based around rivers? Because of transport and the richness of soil for food. So those 'idiots' on the flood plains are the ones putting food on your plate.
But if you live on a flood plain, you do not have the moral high ground to start bitching and being a negative Nancy. The situation may not have been favourable, and you may have been forced to live in that area. Maybe it was job or council that ordained that as your home, but just because you live there doesn't mean you can moan about it. If you took reasonable precaution, then that's cool. You tried your best. At least you have some kind of water raft, a couple of BOB's, and the wherewithal to move expensive furniture upstairs when you get a flood warning. Because these kinds of things would be reasonable precautions. If you're new to prepping or have not got the finances for these things, you have gone through a horrific experience, and probably still are, but at least you're alive. If you've survived it, you can easily learn a valuable lesson.
Granted, any kind of catastrophe will suck. Whether it's 5 feet of water on the Somerset levels, a rising River Thames, or a couple of inches of snow, for wherever NR lives. But there are some situations that just catch you out.
Instead of everyone bitching and moaning, regardless about whether they're effected or not, why not start acting in a more forum style manner, and start supporting one another? Make helpful suggestions? Offer assistance or aid? Instead of name calling and cursing one region, e.g. London, because they have more money than you, or just because you don't like the area and are thus ignorant to it. The same goes with situations that effect people, either you're going through it, or you're ignorant of their situation. Until you ARE that person, you can never truly understand their plight. So why make unhelpful comments time and again? It's been embarrassing hearing people of above average intelligence completely lose their ability to empathise and assist their fellow human beings, let alone their fellow preppers!
Here's an idea, when an earthquake devastates the home you live in and ruins your life, everyone unaffected by it will be entitled to just rip into you for where you live and then gloat about how secure they are. Is that cool? What about a megastorm smashing your home to bits? When that happens, and you turn to people that are meant to be comrades in arms about wanting to learn to survive, how would you feel if they just turned round and were knobs to you? Really uncool behaviour!
Seriously, bickering and the alike not only makes you look silly, but it entirely defeats the idea of trying to learn and develop our preps together!
This is not a gloating game.
This is not a name calling forum.
This is not a North vs South divide forum.
THIS IS A PREPPING FORUM WHERE PEOPLE ARE MEANT TO HELP ONE ANOTHER SURVIVE!!!
If the bitching is what happens when a few of our number are effected, then WTSHTF for us all, I truly feel sorry for us.
Instead of gloating, why not offer aid? Instead of bitching that stuff's going wrong? Get your bags ready to bug out, and start moving furniture upstairs. Trip your fuse box. Board up your walls, air bricks, and the alike. Go crazy with sandbags and volumes of silicone sealant stuff! Call friends and family for help.
We are entitled to help ourselves and our fellow humans, whether it's providing food, blankets, or something like that, or if it's actually going down there and lending a helping hand. Alternatively raise money for charity, open up a spare bedroom to a friend, or whatever.
But please let's just keep this about prepping and the alike. No point being A-Holes to people whom have already been through hell and high water (pun intended there....sorry if it offended anyone).
12 February 2014, 01:00
IMHO highlights we might focus upon during this weather ...
a. flood security - obviously - sandbags, sandless bags, ????
??? Any more suggestions.
b. Food Security - Need to seriously consider at least a 6 month lockdown.
c. Cholera Vaccine - Dukoral
Sewage is beginning to appear - I don't think its going to be long before we have some kind of public health problem
Take Care
a. flood security - obviously - sandbags, sandless bags, ????
??? Any more suggestions.
b. Food Security - Need to seriously consider at least a 6 month lockdown.
c. Cholera Vaccine - Dukoral
Sewage is beginning to appear - I don't think its going to be long before we have some kind of public health problem
Take Care
12 February 2014, 09:36
d door guards ( physical barriers to flood water)
e spare filter candles for water filters
f power supplies after the water has got into the fuse box
g pressure cleaning yards and animal pens after the water recedes
h what cleaners / disinfectants to use in yards ( Jays fluid etc)
I keeping pets outside to prevent them trampling faeces and other detritus into the house
j moving your vehicle to a secure and safe location above the flood water
e spare filter candles for water filters
f power supplies after the water has got into the fuse box
g pressure cleaning yards and animal pens after the water recedes
h what cleaners / disinfectants to use in yards ( Jays fluid etc)
I keeping pets outside to prevent them trampling faeces and other detritus into the house
j moving your vehicle to a secure and safe location above the flood water
12 February 2014, 10:50
I just do not understand, and I am NOT having a go at anyone here, anyone who buys a house on a flood plain, below sea level or near a river, lots of these houses at Kingsand in Cornwall, also Looe in Cornwall and on the Levels(all areas I personally know well) are sometimes bought by "incomers" I suppose they have the excuse that they don't know the area but wouldn't we all do our homework first and find out before buying?? we were offered several properties before we decided to move to our present home, 1 had a large storm drain in the back garden, 1 was 1 street back from the coast, another had no parking and was next to the local primary school, probably some one else would have taken them all but they were not right for us. I suppose non preppers wouldn't see anything wrong with any of these properties but I was looking at them with my prepping hat on and they just weren't right, I say if a property isn't right then its wrong, there is no grey area...not for us anyway.