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+--- Thread: Epiphany leading to a radical rethink! (/showthread.php?tid=6526)
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Epiphany leading to a radical rethink! - Midnitemo - 9 February 2014
Yesterday a partook in my annual dose of sadism that is the Dragon Rally.....arrived at the rally to find it was a caravan park just outside Conway , first thought's sites on a great big hill in the teeth of 60mph winds but its terraced and flat with hardstanding for the bikes so not all bad(have you ever tried picking up 300 kilo's of stricken bike out of the mud?)pitched camp pretty quickly on a lumpy bit of ground that was slightly sheltered by the terracing(only slightly)and not in range of any deadfall, happy day's so of to the bar to collect my goody bag, badge and first of many beers, more beers flowed followed by a communal chilli cooked on the stoves followed by more beer a band some more beer a nightcap or six then bed....pretty normal Dragon rally you might think! but what I haven't mentioned is it never stopped raining and the wind never let up either....the guy's and gal's(3 this year woo hoo)I do this rally with are all old hands and have partaken in some pretty rough extreme winter rallies in there time(Ellefantreffen,Krystal et al)so they all come prepared with good kit and a steely attitude but everybody had kit failiure of one type or another....when people surfaced in the morning to yet more wind and rain they all looked like death warmed up , almost shellshocked , I had a particularly wet noisy restless night and it got me to thinking that I can't drag my party around gods creation bugging out in weather like this, they wouldn't last a week , so I've made the decision we are bugging in no matter what,
RE: Epiphany leading to a radical rethink! - Scythe13 - 9 February 2014
That's a hell of a time you had there mate. Wish I was at the DR with you. Sounds awesome...even though I don't drink.
Similar on Dartmoor (colder on Dartmoor, but probably nowhere near as windy...I even managed an hour or 2's sleep) has made me rethink and reinforce much of my gear. It's getting out in the harshest of elements that shows what you have got right and what you need to sort out. I feel bad for those who have not tested their gear properly.
I might have been reading too much into this, and jumped to the conclusion that you are never going to Bug Out. If I have jumped to that conclusion, then I'm sorry. I've misread the situation. But if I'm right in my conclusion, before you totally cut out the idea of bugging out, may I make a few suggestions and note some thoughts that came into my head after my 'alternative weather' experience?
Have you thought about a different bug out route? One that has much more shelter and cover? What about new BOL's (Bug Out Locations), such as quarries or heavily wooded areas (with strong set trees of course)? Hedges are amazing at cutting down the wind strength. It's even possible to make up a small fence to reduce your wind exposure. There is even the option to start digging a pit for shelter, the upturned soil can be used as extra walls around the pit. Also if the pockets have enough depth, arctic or expedition level tents? They'll cost more, but will also stand up to much more. Maybe even an upgrade of the parts that you foresee failing, like how I'm going to experiment with Easton poles? I remember watching a video of some people in the US caught in a tornado. They took shelter in the upper sections of an underpass. That kept them safe from a tornado! Granted you might not want to be that close to a road, but there are always options if you need them.
If conditions are that bad, it might even be worth getting some small climbing harnesses (probably overkill, but you know me) or similar and tethering yourself to the littlest ones, to keep them with you and secure. On an up note, if conditions really are that bad, the odds of 'undesirables' being out and about is greatly reduced. So at least that's one positive.
Imagine your retreat/home is on fire, are you honestly not going to bug out? Even though you may not be planning to bug out, you might not necessarily have much of an option. If staying put was a guaranteed save choice, I think we'd all go with that. But most people have planned to Bug Out, incase there are not other options.
Oh, there's always the option of just travelling to an alternative location, that's within a relatively short distance. Say, an abandoned house down the road, a warehouse, or something like that. Instead of making a huge 100 mile trek, you could make many 10 miles treks, from safe house to safe house.
RE: Epiphany leading to a radical rethink! - Midnitemo - 10 February 2014
Pretty much no we will not be bugging out(unless the bug in is levelled in which case we will relocate in the immediate vicinity as my group have 5 houses between us all within a square mile, my group is an ageing one ,4 teenagers and upto 9 adults ranging in age from 49(me)to 82(father inlaw) I can't in all good conscience bug out with that group in this kind of weather, were just going to have to dig in like ticks on a hide and stand our ground cos bugging out will kill most of them unless I had a prepared location to go to(which I don't)
RE: Epiphany leading to a radical rethink! - Devonian - 10 February 2014
No matter how expensive the equipment you have, bugging out and then remaining under canvas is not a realistic option for anyone in the long term, yes its fine for a few days, even a few weeks, but it is not a realistic option for long term survival, especially if you have young and old as part of your group. But that also doesn't mean bugging out shouldn't be an option, there are many alternatives to living in a tent!
RE: Epiphany leading to a radical rethink! - Lightspeed - 10 February 2014
Completely agree with you Devonian.
Family living under canvass is really only a temporary option. In our climate we need to plan solid roofs and walls for permanent habitation.
Under canvass is OK for short term shelter when fleeing to a fixed structure BOL or for very short term evacuation of Bug In Location, prior to return.
Good luck with your new plans mate.
RE: Epiphany leading to a radical rethink! - River Song - 10 February 2014
Current weather has caused many to rethink.
The decision to focus on bugging in is surely wise but of course
there should also be a back up.
What has sharpened my mind in the present climate is
the inability for TPTB to do anything really useful.
When I reviewed the London Major Incident Plan, my initial comment
was that they were too interested on who was going to be Gold or Silver or Bronze and making
sure that they kept the minutes of the meeting. Having said that the response to a major terrorist incidents was good.
It's when the response has been delegated to county resilience teams that it goes bad. I would be very interested to see an analysis of Somerset County Resilience after this is all over. (if it ever is going to be over!)
Keep warm and dry peeps.
Allons-y
RE: Epiphany leading to a radical rethink! - Midnitemo - 10 February 2014
I still have a BOL with a couple of caches planted and will continue to keep bags at the ready but the conditions required to activate a bug out have gone way up from the previous ones....definately a sit tight plan for now as my current group dynamic stands, god forbid the inlaws aren't around anymore and the plan will get reviewed.
RE: Epiphany leading to a radical rethink! - NorthernRaider - 10 February 2014
This issue is one that has arisen far to often over the years and I'm bloody delighted someone else has had the foresight and wisdom to address it. Al to often we get folks joining the forums and saying they have all the gear and are going to bug out and live in a basha in the woods. I always asked of them about how their extended families feel about this, is the wifey happy to live for months in mid winter under a tarp, is granny going to be happy climbing down to a stream to collected water, what about infant children, parents etc.
The problem often is that the folks coming into prepping and survivalism are single fit young men AND they cannot differentiate between BUSHCRAFT / WILDERNESS SURVIVAL and prepping and survivalism both being related but completely different genres.
Midnitemo has got it right doing ralleys in winter on yer tod is one thing, I used to do Storming the Castle and Pissed n Broke and Dragonslayer among other out of season bike rallies, flippin great for a weekend on my GS1000 but not a method of survival I would choose for months with my wife and child along.
But I don't think its just climate that get under considered when planning preps, its the art of getting out of Dodge that is a major issue for us in the UK cos not only is the weather usually wet and cold even in summer but many / most roads are borderling gridlocked for hours every day, it would only take the current bad weather coupled with a government evacuation order and only one or two accidents to reduce entire regions highways to complete gridlock.
Bugging in is very prundent and wise providing the place you are bugging into is SUSTAINABLE and DEFENDABLE and preferable partially self reliant at least.
I also agree with Devonians comments about trying to live for any length of time under canvas as being REALLY undesirable, I would add caravans to that equasion cos a few years ago I had to live FT in a small touring caravan and if it was not freezing it was turning everything we had mouldy.
I still have reserve bug out plans but its to a brick built structure with a door and window that is at least dry and mould free, but my long term plans are definitely remaining bugged in here.
RE: Epiphany leading to a radical rethink! - Scythe13 - 10 February 2014
I'd look at 3 options.
1. Best Case Scenario.
You can hunker down and survive at home. That would be awesome!
2. Worst Case Scenario.
You are forced away from home and have no BOL. This would suck!
3. Something Between Options 1 and 2.
You are forced away from home, but have a BOL to go to.
Providing you are happy you have been able to account for these instances, you'll be able to face whatever's coming your way.
RE: Epiphany leading to a radical rethink! - NorthernRaider - 10 February 2014
I think that next year or not long after I'll get another van and fit it out as a camper van again, this will give me a mobile temporary bug out vehicle I should be able to live in for some weeks.