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+--- Thread: Stove Fuel (/showthread.php?tid=1723)
Stove Fuel - Timelord - 30 April 2012
Last night I was reading a forum for Amateur Near Earth Space craft Enthusiasts. To my surprise that was! Came across it while looking up some 2m Ham Walkietalki mods. Anyway, when reading further on their spec for building kit that will work in the v.cold space of --- well space, there was a section that reminded me of when I once lived in a caravan for a few years. The stove ran on gas. Butane gas. I was informed at the time that seeing as I would be living in the van through a British winter, then the butane would freeze at approx zero degrees and it would be impossible to light. Therefore I changed to propane and used it from then on. The space tecchy website also warned against using a conventional burner at these low temps because most of the gas canisters available in camping shops were butane.
I realise now that this could have a bearing on preppers who pack gas stoves, like Scythe used in his challenge in the woods. I hadn't thought about it before in the prepper sense because I use a meths burner and it is not affected.
RE: Stove Fuel - Scythe13 - 1 May 2012
Guess who'll be looking into an alcohol stove now?!?!?!? haha
RE: Stove Fuel - Nemesis - 1 May 2012
Was you two talking about one of these other day, sale on now.
http://www.gooutdoors.co.uk/intensity-gas-stove-p158213
I use meths as well and wood, wax balls.
RE: Stove Fuel - Roscoe - 1 May 2012
This is a pretty good topic TL, upon a bit of research and thinking a little ahead of time, if SHTF then the most accessible type of fuel source in my head would be petrol with most cars in britain being petrol it is a hugely available product and efficient up to -60. The only issue with this is that the stoves normally get dirtied up pretty quickly on unleaded and this mean regular cleaning and maintenance of the stove (which in fairness isn't that bad).
If thats not to your taste then the best bet is to keep the butane gas properly insulated and kept in warmer conditions. That way you're not having to worry about not being able to cook your spag bol
RE: Stove Fuel - Timelord - 1 May 2012
Yes Roscoe, that is where I am heading. I was only today discussing with a prep collegue that it is likely you can run a meths burner on substitute fuels. I suggested to him that petrol readily found in abandoned cars etc could be mixed with other inflammable fuels to increase its consistancy so that it would burn ok on the burner and we also realised this would probably make it more smokey. This may or may not be a problem but with some experimentation you might be able to get the mix better and also find other flammable liquids that would substitute and/or mix with petrol. Petrol may well be the most common source of fuel available in a PSHTF scenario for the short to mid term.
My collegue suggested one of those pump up modern compact primus stoves. Those advertised as multifuel. They are still expensive at over £100 and have more components to go wrong. I would think they are a good bet if the price is no issue. I am going to stick with the tried & tested venturi effect liquid fuel burner and experiment in the near future. Regards, TL.
RE: Stove Fuel - Nemesis - 1 May 2012
When you cook using petrol through a meths type burner you get black particles that flout and settle on the drink/food, I tried this on a sea front like 15 years ago maybe petrol don't do that no more I don't know, but as I do have a very large selection of meth cookers/burners sets I would hope if you do get this petrol mix sorted to let me know.
RE: Stove Fuel - Roscoe - 1 May 2012
W&C I think with the removal of a lot of additives in petrol that maybe things are different using petrol. I should really find this out, seeing as though on our site we make an additive for diesel. I'm also not sure if all petrol is the same (as in not the same additives in the same quantities) so that may make a difference...I may just be blowing hot air there though.
Whatever you do dont use diesel unless you're using it in your car
RE: Stove Fuel - Nemesis - 1 May 2012
(1 May 2012, 22:37)Roscoe Wrote: W&C I think with the removal of a lot of additives in petrol that maybe things are different using petrol. I should really find this out, seeing as though on our site we make an additive for diesel. I'm also not sure if all petrol is the same (as in not the same additives in the same quantities) so that may make a difference...I may just be blowing hot air there though.
Whatever you do dont use diesel unless you're using it in your car
You know old petrol won't run an engine after time, would this affect petrol stoves and lamps the same way, or take longer before it can't fuel them.
I have 3 petrol stoves one I call a group stove, here is my youtube video excuse the music I did do a commentary but the burners were too loud over my voice.
RE: Stove Fuel - Timelord - 1 May 2012
From my own recollection, an internal combustion engine is designed to run on a specific band of octane rating (cetane). Therefore when the petrol degrades and the octane rating reduces, then it will not readily explode to the required degree inside that design of engine.
Unless you require an explosion - which is not recommended for a stove - then the above should not matter. The petrol will still "burn" and be ignited manually readily enough. In an engine, the ratio of air to fuel is controlled. Outside of an engine this is not as critical. A stove will have a very rudimentary control of ratio if at all. Like I say, just to burn the petrol or petrol fuel mix should not be any problem. Degraded petrol will not have quite such a high energy value, but so far as to cook foodstuffs, it will not be that apparent.
A lamp that uses pressure to force the petrol to vapourise should still operate ok but may not be quite as bright on its max setting, although I think it would be hard to tell and the mantle (catalyst) may not notice the difference either.
I suppose there may come a point the petrol is degrading to the point it is seriously reduced in efficiency but I think this will be quite a way down the road.
You could always mix it with some home brewed distilled alcohol by then..:-)
Regards, TL.
(I.M.O.)
Just seen the utube vid.
BIG :-)
That is an awesome stove. Is it one of those military vehicle kits? A German jobby?
Could you mount that on a backpack, like one of those Norweigan rucksack frames. Fit a higher pressure manual control flow valve and reduce the number of jets and possibly make the remaining ones larger?? Umm, toy time!
RE: Stove Fuel - Nemesis - 2 May 2012
That one is Swiss Army part of a field kitchen, I can't get hold of the pots that go with it as they are rare, but I made up for that with a set of Britt Army field kitchen pots.
By the way I placed my order for the rucksack, hoping to use it for when I run for now and then woods in summer if I can get break from commitment at home.