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+---- Thread: Survival Radio Musts, Shoulds, Coulds (/showthread.php?tid=2242)
Survival Radio Musts, Shoulds, Coulds - Lightspeed - 30 July 2012
The Musts Shoulds and Coulds of Survival Radio Communications
We're starting to drift all over the place in deciding common survivor radio coms standards. I've written this to try and pull together the thoughts and oppinions that have been expressed.
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Rationale for Survivor Radio coms:
While keeping heads down and completely out of sight , deploying radio equipment allows survivors to gather information about the outside world, and ultimately communicate with that world, from the safety and invisibility of their retreat.
SUK members have been actively discussing Survivor radio communications for many months. Our discussions have determined three important criteria that apply to selection of equipment. These are:
1. Must Haves,
2. Should haves,
3. Could haves
1a. Must Have: Radio receiver
• Capable of receiving FM, MW, LW
• Ideally capable of receiving Shortwave as well
• This will give survivors feedback from the outside world as
described by the Powers that Be.
• Absolutely every prepper ought to have at least one battery
powered receiver of this type.
• Lowest cost for something battery powered that will cover
all of these bands is £2.00 , yes two pounds ( from
Superdrug when they have them in stock)
1b. Must Have: PMR446 or dual band handheld capable
of PMR446 operation
• Give a real view of the immediate outside environment to a
maximum of 500 metres to5 km, from your retreat.
• Used for communication with and between family, friends
and other survivors in the immediate vicinity
• Long term PMR446 and its equivalents are seen as the most
viable communications equipment for scouting parties, as
well as having the potential to act as a common conflict
avoidance tool.
• These are small walkie-talkie devices, self contained and
simple to operate.
• Cost to implement approx £50.00 for new equipment. Often
a pair of PMR446 radios can be had new for this price.
2. Should Have: CB radio
• Would be survivors should plan to be able to receive
feedback from, and possibly communicate over, a wider
area, equating to distance approximately equivalent to one
day’s return journey on foot from their retreat / BOL. This
is approximately 10 miles range.
• 10 mile range CB based stations will be primarily static.
Either at the Retreat / BOL or at fixed remote locations.
• Most CB radios are designed for in-vehicle use and run on
12V. They are the size of a medium sized book , have a
microphone on a coiled wire and a plug on the back into
which an antenna is plugged.
• Preferred the equipment will be capable of operating in FM
Mode on 40 or 80 standardised UK CB frequency channels.
• CB radios of this type are very simple to operate.
• Some CBs that meet the needed specification are available
as walkie-talkie format handheld units. These are multi
purpose, being usable in the field or connected to vehicle
mobile or base station external antennas.
• Base antennas can be extremely discreet wire construction,
and easily DIY constructed
• Cost of equipment approximately £ 100 to £ 150 for a
complete new equipment station. Half this if purchased off
e-bay / car boot sales.
3. Could Have: NVIS Ham type stations
• Some Survivors will have a requirement to receive feedback
from, and possibly communicate over distances of hundreds
of miles. Effectively this is close to nationwide coverage.
• National network coverage can only be achieved by
collaborating with other similarly equipped stations situated
in favorable geographic locations.
• Stations needing continuous coverage out to 200 miles,
also those located in deep valleys or heavily wooded areas
fall into this group.
• SUK discussions have identified that a Near Vertical
Incident Skywave (NVIS) technique is the preferred route.
• For NVIS operating Frequencies of 7MHz and 3.5MHz are
required. These frequencies require wire antennas up to 40
metres long.
• For most reliable communications and most robust /
economic equipment SUK is specifying use of Morse Code as
the transmission mode.
• Base antennas can be discreet wire construction, and fairly
easily DIY constructed
• In the current environment, this equipment may only be
legally operated by licensed Radio Amateurs
• Cost of equipment approximately £ 300 to £ 500 for a
complete station.
RE: Survival Radio Musts, Shoulds, Coulds - Paul - 30 July 2012
Wind up and solar charged general broadcast radios are a bit more expensive £15-up but last for ages.
Very few manufacturers do a decent AM, FM, and Shortwave solar/wind up radio.
The Eton FR160 works well for me.
Prices vary wildly. Mine cost £22 from a market stall.
Shopping round is vital, I found one (annoyingly the day after) on fleabay at £15 p&p inc.
RE: Survival Radio Musts, Shoulds, Coulds - NorthernRaider - 30 July 2012
REF the PMR 446 doofahs, and the issues involved in their pathetic low power, I'm pretty sure not so long back I spotted some 7 watt PMR446 units on Ebay.
These appear to cover the range included in the PMR 446 range ?
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Portable-UHF-VHF-7W-CB-ham-radio-Walkie-Talkie-Two-Way-Radio-color-FM-radio-H555-/150784073406?pt=UK_ConsumerElectronics_SpecialistRadioEquipment_SM&hash=item231b6e5ebe
RE: Survival Radio Musts, Shoulds, Coulds - Bug_out_Bag - 30 July 2012
I've got one of these wind up, solar powered, battery charging, mobile phone charging radios. It is excellent. Bought from this seller on Ebay, took an age to arrive but is brilliant! I'm very happy with it!
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/DEGEN-Cranking-Dynamo-Solar-Power-Supply-FM-MW-SW-RADIO-With-LED-Flashlight-/330771469492?pt=US_Portable_AM_FM_Radios&hash=item4d038414b4
I forgot to mention it has a LED torch, Red signal flashing torch and audible alarm built in too.
quote='Bug_out_Bag' pid='20052' dateline='1343657575']
I've got one of these wind up, solar powered, battery charging, mobile phone charging radios. It is excellent. Bought from this seller on Ebay, took an age to arrive but is brilliant! I'm very happy with it!
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/DEGEN-Cranking-Dynamo-Solar-Power-Supply-FM-MW-SW-RADIO-With-LED-Flashlight-/330771469492?pt=US_Portable_AM_FM_Radios&hash=item4d038414b4
[/quote]
RE: Survival Radio Musts, Shoulds, Coulds - Lightspeed - 30 July 2012
(30 July 2012, 15:07)NorthernRaider Wrote: REF the PMR 446 doofahs, and the issues involved in their pathetic low power, I'm pretty sure not so long back I spotted some 7 watt PMR446 units on Ebay.
These appear to cover the range included in the PMR 446 range ?
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Portable-UHF-VHF-7W-CB-ham-radio-Walkie-Talkie-Two-Way-Radio-color-FM-radio-H555-/150784073406?pt=UK_ConsumerElectronics_SpecialistRadioEquipment_SM&hash=item231b6e5ebe
Correct NR there are Chineese 7w units available, but you're better off with better antennas than higher power rigs... See Paul's recent posts.
I wasn't bullshitting when reporting 53 Km with PMR446 0.5w last weekend (BTW full quietening reception at both ends Paul, I forgot to reply to your question on that)
LS
RE: Survival Radio Musts, Shoulds, Coulds - Paul - 31 July 2012
(30 July 2012, 15:16)Lightspeed Wrote:(30 July 2012, 15:07)NorthernRaider Wrote: REF the PMR 446 doofahs, and the issues involved in their pathetic low power, I'm pretty sure not so long back I spotted some 7 watt PMR446 units on Ebay.
These appear to cover the range included in the PMR 446 range ?
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Portable-UHF-VHF-7W-CB-ham-radio-Walkie-Talkie-Two-Way-Radio-color-FM-radio-H555-/150784073406?pt=UK_ConsumerElectronics_SpecialistRadioEquipment_SM&hash=item231b6e5ebe
Correct NR there are Chineese 7w units available, but you're better off with better antennas than higher power rigs... See Paul's recent posts.
I wasn't bullshitting when reporting 53 Km with PMR446 0.5w last weekend (BTW full quietening reception at both ends Paul, I forgot to reply to your question on that)
LS
Why should anyone think you were BS'ing LS? Certainly not me.
I've worked 15 miles on 49Mhz @ 250mW before on the Malvern Hills before now so like you I know what altitude can do in reality.
RE: Survival Radio Musts, Shoulds, Coulds - Skean Dhude - 31 July 2012
Excellent summary.
As you all know I'm going the full spectrum route. So looking at that now. All LS needs to do now is a recommended list of kit and a minimal list of kit so we can mix and match. Bring all the posts with kit recommendations into one.
RE: Survival Radio Musts, Shoulds, Coulds - Lightspeed - 31 July 2012
NR
I don't like the look of these at all.
Then again they may be OK, but anything proposing to be a fashion radio is going to get a thumbs down from me.
Technical spec does not give enough info to see if they will comply with PMR446
In a dire emergency and with nothing else to hand they would work. But they'd be the last on my list of options.
Again, its good receivers and good antennas that thare the key, not raw power output.
LS
(31 July 2012, 07:28)Skean Dhude Wrote: Excellent summary.
As you all know I'm going the full spectrum route. So looking at that now. All LS needs to do now is a recommended list of kit and a minimal list of kit so we can mix and match. Bring all the posts with kit recommendations into one.
Thanks SD,
Re kit list, we're onto this. Should be available quite quickly.
LS
RE: Survival Radio Musts, Shoulds, Coulds - NorthernRaider - 31 July 2012
I'm not doubting LS just trying to be a useful part of the debate
, I do doubt the value of PMRs in general though cos i can should further than those things will broadcast generally ??Now putting on my technical hat here is a video of Light Speed broadcasting on PMR 446 on You tube, his first transmission is a 48 seconds
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xn_MLtoyO2E&feature=related
RE: Survival Radio Musts, Shoulds, Coulds - Lightspeed - 31 July 2012
(31 July 2012, 09:06)NorthernRaider Wrote: I'm not doubting LS just trying to be a useful part of the debate
Now putting on my technical hat here is a video of Light Speed broadcasting on PMR 446 on You tube, his first transmission is a 48 seconds
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xn_MLtoyO2E&feature=related
I told you I as atracting too much attention..... didn't realise you were filming me though NR!
( No offense taken to earlier post by the way, just an injection of colourful language in my reply)
LS