from Off The Grid News

[BDG]

(31 January 2013, 00:25)cryingfreeman Wrote: Careful now, that's a bit shilly. Refute this: Firing range ammunition is much cheaper stuff, not even typically used by the general public in the USA outside of ranges. Your ricochet-avoidance-in-training argument looks good, except for the fact that it's cobblers. Nobody uses hollow points in training in the USA.

They are not generally used at the moment, so that means the government is buying them so it can take over? Oh wait, it is already in charge.

(31 January 2013, 00:25)cryingfreeman Wrote: Hollow points, just to reiterate, have a specific purpose: maximum damage to human flesh with minimum aiming skill. They're so horrific that they're banned for use in war under the Geneva Convention. But that's okay because when the police in the USA use them they do so because they stop in the target and don't pass on through and hit someone else. How thoughtful.

People in this thread keep on saying how bad they are, how they are banned for use in war and the damage they do. Have you seen the damage a 5.56 military round does? Or a 7.62? It does not send you to a tea party. A 7.62 in the shoulder will take your arm off. A 5.56 in the head will take what you have between your ears out of the other side.

The hollow points that have been quoted as being bought seem to be handgun rounds. The premise is that these handguns are going to be used to take semi automatic rifles from people. Ask yourself:

"would I five other people armed with pistols activly put ourselves into a gunfight against two people armed with semi automatic rifles?"

Your hollow points are going to put you at even more of a disadvantage due to their ballistic characteristics here too. Let someone know where you plan on going so they can collect your bodies and arrange your funerals.

(31 January 2013, 00:25)cryingfreeman Wrote: Here's another point for your irrefutable mathematical analysis: in the entire Iraq War the US military used 70 million rounds each year.

Your point, while coming from Maj. Gen. Jerry Curry and I think you took it from Infowars. He pulled the number out of his arse.

When you look at records from the House of Representatives, it was around 10 million rounds a month average, and that average was based on the main war and the relativley quiet period afterwards, not the periods seeing a lot of insurgent attacks and response to those attacks.

The following document discusses what is being used and the manufacturing and logistical challenges that were faced - which were and still are - a shortage of ammo.

http://commdocs.house.gov/committees/sec...6250_0.HTM

(31 January 2013, 00:25)cryingfreeman Wrote: That's less than 10% of this DHS 5 year option on 750 million body-destroyer hollow points.

Body destroyer? As opposed to what? 5.56, 7.62, 9mm, .45 and .50 cal rounds that tell you to lie face down on the ground with your arms outstreched until someone plasticuffs you?

(31 January 2013, 00:25)cryingfreeman Wrote: So even if they only take up one year on their option, that's 150 million hollow points for just one US government department's domestic use.

A governments department that has many agencies under it.

(31 January 2013, 00:25)cryingfreeman Wrote: Over double what the US military used each year in Iraq!

We will disagree on what was used in Iraq, as no one really knows. Does it not shock you that a government can have recieopts for the bullets it bought, be able to do an inventory check on what it has, but still not confirm that what it has not got has been used and so say 'We used X bullets'?

And you expect this level of ineptitude to subjugate 310 million people, 80 million of whom are armed, with around 270 million guns in civilian ownership and these civilians buying 10 BILLION ROUNDS A YEAR?

(31 January 2013, 00:25)cryingfreeman Wrote: And this all at a time when war is being declared on the armed sector of the American public. Coincidence?

Oh, who signed this decleration of war? Can I see a copy of it please?

(31 January 2013, 00:25)cryingfreeman Wrote: Come on chaps, you're survivalists. You're not allowed to believe in coincidences any more!!!

I am a guy with a bit of land I get food from, I hunt, I shoot I fish. I have some stocks of foodstuff, I have skills and the tools to put them to use. All very normal things 60+ years ago in this country. People then did not define themselves as 'Survivalists' any more than people who go to work in an office now to pay their mortgage and buy the essentials of life do now.

What I believe in is that to be safe I have to rely on me more and 'them', whoever them is, less.

I stratify risk, and the way I see it, the US government replenishing its ammo stocks after more than a decade of spraying them all over the place is very, very, very low to a guy like me in the UK - its up there with the risk of catching gonorrhoea from a space angel from the planet Gloopysoup.