15 May 2013, 09:01
15 May 2013, 14:40
This is a very interesting question, often contemplated by many on here.
With all injuries and the alike, taken aside, there are a few of us that could survive until old age screwed us over. But there are others that would have an issue with a bit too much rain on a cold day.
Deep down, I think we all have expectations tainted by personal bias. We all like to think we're capable of much more than we've actually proven to ourselves. Truth is, we probably are capable of MUCH more than we've tried, so far. But we'll not get an accurate gauge of our abilities until it's a bit too late.
I was taught that ability x effort = results. Problem is, if you have no ability, or put in no effort, the result is zero (death). From this it seems clear that attitude gives you a HUGE advantage, but you still need some ability. It's like Highlander says, we should be able to make a shelter. If you cannot make a shelter, that's not a problem, it just means it's time to learn a new skill. If you THINK you can make a shelter, but have not yet done so, I'd highly recommend getting out into the woods or garden and give it a go. You can pick up twigs, branches, leaves, and all the rest from the woods if you need to, then cart them back home and practice in your garden. Now that you've tried to build a shelter, can you do the same thing in winter, when there is likely to be less stuff lay about everywhere, when you're shivering and with clouded thoughts from the cold? Different kettle of fish hu? It's for this reason that my BOB has thermals in. If it's summer and I have to bug out, they're great for laying on the sleeping bag instead of wrapping up too warm (technically I'm a layers freak, so use less layers, but the principle is there), but also, thermals are useful because you don't know how long you're going to be out there for!
Food is another issue. Tarrel knows his food levels very well. I'd best most people have just jammed a load of MRE's into their bags and not thought too much about restocking and the alike. Catching food is vital, foraging is vital, trapping is vital, water filtration is vital, good nutrition is vital, but most of all, practicing these skills and then knowing their effectiveness is SUPER VITAL!!! Reading a business book doesn't make you a company CEO any more than reading a Ray Mears book makes you a wilderness survival legend!!! REALISE THAT!!! Knowledge without practice is not just 'potential power' it's also very damn dangerous!
Okay, back on track, kind of went off on one there didn't I?!? Sorry.
For me, I'd say I could last 3 months from my bag, using the replenishing equipment I have for food and the alike. I say 3 months, because after that, I'd expect the world to be back to a certain level of normality. I would be able to survive longer, if called to do so, but I think I would resort to urban foraging for the first part of it, and after 3 months, I'd expect a die off that would lend itself favourably to someone inclined to do what needed to be done to survive.
It's a really hard one to call. During the 3 months, I'd lay low for the first one or 2, but then would spend the last month I would set to building a log cabin style single room....if possible, I'd like to be near to a pine forest because what little practice I've had was with pine. After that, I'd be bugging in a BOL.
See how this gets tricky?
I don't plan on bugging out indefinitely. I plan on going to a predetermined BOL or build a BOS (Bug Out Shelter) in my BOL that would become home, or a temporary shelter......by then I'd be bugging in.
With all injuries and the alike, taken aside, there are a few of us that could survive until old age screwed us over. But there are others that would have an issue with a bit too much rain on a cold day.
Deep down, I think we all have expectations tainted by personal bias. We all like to think we're capable of much more than we've actually proven to ourselves. Truth is, we probably are capable of MUCH more than we've tried, so far. But we'll not get an accurate gauge of our abilities until it's a bit too late.
I was taught that ability x effort = results. Problem is, if you have no ability, or put in no effort, the result is zero (death). From this it seems clear that attitude gives you a HUGE advantage, but you still need some ability. It's like Highlander says, we should be able to make a shelter. If you cannot make a shelter, that's not a problem, it just means it's time to learn a new skill. If you THINK you can make a shelter, but have not yet done so, I'd highly recommend getting out into the woods or garden and give it a go. You can pick up twigs, branches, leaves, and all the rest from the woods if you need to, then cart them back home and practice in your garden. Now that you've tried to build a shelter, can you do the same thing in winter, when there is likely to be less stuff lay about everywhere, when you're shivering and with clouded thoughts from the cold? Different kettle of fish hu? It's for this reason that my BOB has thermals in. If it's summer and I have to bug out, they're great for laying on the sleeping bag instead of wrapping up too warm (technically I'm a layers freak, so use less layers, but the principle is there), but also, thermals are useful because you don't know how long you're going to be out there for!
Food is another issue. Tarrel knows his food levels very well. I'd best most people have just jammed a load of MRE's into their bags and not thought too much about restocking and the alike. Catching food is vital, foraging is vital, trapping is vital, water filtration is vital, good nutrition is vital, but most of all, practicing these skills and then knowing their effectiveness is SUPER VITAL!!! Reading a business book doesn't make you a company CEO any more than reading a Ray Mears book makes you a wilderness survival legend!!! REALISE THAT!!! Knowledge without practice is not just 'potential power' it's also very damn dangerous!
Okay, back on track, kind of went off on one there didn't I?!? Sorry.
For me, I'd say I could last 3 months from my bag, using the replenishing equipment I have for food and the alike. I say 3 months, because after that, I'd expect the world to be back to a certain level of normality. I would be able to survive longer, if called to do so, but I think I would resort to urban foraging for the first part of it, and after 3 months, I'd expect a die off that would lend itself favourably to someone inclined to do what needed to be done to survive.
It's a really hard one to call. During the 3 months, I'd lay low for the first one or 2, but then would spend the last month I would set to building a log cabin style single room....if possible, I'd like to be near to a pine forest because what little practice I've had was with pine. After that, I'd be bugging in a BOL.
See how this gets tricky?
I don't plan on bugging out indefinitely. I plan on going to a predetermined BOL or build a BOS (Bug Out Shelter) in my BOL that would become home, or a temporary shelter......by then I'd be bugging in.
15 May 2013, 23:58
A big unknown for me is the psychology, and I wouldn't underestimate the impact of this on staying power.
I have tested myself on multi-week backpacking / wildcamping treks but, although these go some way to simulating a bug-out situation physically, they do not do so psychologically. With a multi-day or week backpack, you are constantly moving towards an objective, and there is an implicit understanding that you will get to the end, and BAU. A true post-SHTF situation would be very different, with many unknowns, probably the need to change routes, plans, etc at short notice, and maybe a lot of drifting and hanging around to see the lie of the land and what happens next. Very diiferent.
Would I cope with this? Who knows? I suspect someone with military training (which I don't have), might be better equipped to deal with this aspect, but this is just an assumption.
I have tested myself on multi-week backpacking / wildcamping treks but, although these go some way to simulating a bug-out situation physically, they do not do so psychologically. With a multi-day or week backpack, you are constantly moving towards an objective, and there is an implicit understanding that you will get to the end, and BAU. A true post-SHTF situation would be very different, with many unknowns, probably the need to change routes, plans, etc at short notice, and maybe a lot of drifting and hanging around to see the lie of the land and what happens next. Very diiferent.
Would I cope with this? Who knows? I suspect someone with military training (which I don't have), might be better equipped to deal with this aspect, but this is just an assumption.
16 May 2013, 12:35
Personally I plan to bug in and only bug out if I absolutely have no other choice but to give up my position to a greater force and then to only bug out until I find a new defensible bug in position....As a London Based guy, and many will leave or be removed so i'm sure their will be plenty of housing stock left to use.
16 May 2013, 14:09
I`ve done a 5 day stint in the woods (end of August)
First three days I had all my gear and ate once a day, cooking on an open fire with billy cans.
The last days were spent with nothing but a knife, fire steel and the clothes I was wearing, no food but I did have water.
I had to make a shelter, get a fire going and forage for food. The shelter and fire was the easy bit apart from burning down my wooden heat shield! The shelter was surprisingly warm, comfy and dry as it rained overnight I wasn’t expecting to stay dry !
The foraging was the hardest for me as knowing what you can and can’t eat was a real struggle , If I had to do this past 2 or 3 days I’d reckon I would really struggle.
Depending on what resources I had (food, water, shelter) to hand i.e. in my pack would depend on hold long I could last. I reckon 72hrs with my kit.
So how long would I last, honestly I don’t know ?
First three days I had all my gear and ate once a day, cooking on an open fire with billy cans.
The last days were spent with nothing but a knife, fire steel and the clothes I was wearing, no food but I did have water.
I had to make a shelter, get a fire going and forage for food. The shelter and fire was the easy bit apart from burning down my wooden heat shield! The shelter was surprisingly warm, comfy and dry as it rained overnight I wasn’t expecting to stay dry !
The foraging was the hardest for me as knowing what you can and can’t eat was a real struggle , If I had to do this past 2 or 3 days I’d reckon I would really struggle.
Depending on what resources I had (food, water, shelter) to hand i.e. in my pack would depend on hold long I could last. I reckon 72hrs with my kit.
So how long would I last, honestly I don’t know ?
16 May 2013, 21:57
We are all capable of a lot more than we think we are, providing we get a decent start at it.
You start off with your BOB, you know its not going to last, you know that you are going to be forced to find shelter and food,..so you start to do that,..I am sure that many will fail at first, so you eat some of your stores,... then you try again
The thing is, that the longer you are out there and surviving, the more chance you have of survival, .... the two things that will help you along the most is staying dry and warm,.. this gives you a feel good factor, without both of these you will go down fast,.. you will give in,..its mind over matter,..feeling good gets you up and ready to try again
Not all of us are going to have training in survival, so it will be down to self taught survival, read all you can, go out a practice for a few days, these will certainly help and give you confidence
You start off with your BOB, you know its not going to last, you know that you are going to be forced to find shelter and food,..so you start to do that,..I am sure that many will fail at first, so you eat some of your stores,... then you try again
The thing is, that the longer you are out there and surviving, the more chance you have of survival, .... the two things that will help you along the most is staying dry and warm,.. this gives you a feel good factor, without both of these you will go down fast,.. you will give in,..its mind over matter,..feeling good gets you up and ready to try again
Not all of us are going to have training in survival, so it will be down to self taught survival, read all you can, go out a practice for a few days, these will certainly help and give you confidence
16 May 2013, 23:13
(14 May 2013, 19:19)Sunna Wrote: [ -> ]the last 2 winters have been freezing with temperatures averaging zero to minus 13, our summers well rain rain rain.
how long could you last bugging out .
Depends really, everything is difficult when you have a toddler. Have the necessary gear to set up home somewhere, food in winter is the problem. That's if we're staying put somewhere, which we'd need to. Even without children you can't just keep on moving. That's not bugging out, that's being a refugee
17 May 2013, 08:07
Well if I bugged out to one of my pre arranged locations where I have caches hidden probably 4 to 5 months at an extreme stretch, and about 7 days if you crashing out anywhere else.
10 June 2013, 06:51
(14 May 2013, 19:19)Sunna Wrote: [ -> ]the last 2 winters have been freezing with temperatures averaging zero to minus 13, our summers well rain rain rain.
how long could you last bugging out .
I'd last until I am diagnosed with A slight case of death
10 June 2013, 07:50
(16 May 2013, 12:35)The Ragman Wrote: [ -> ]Personally I plan to bug in and only bug out if I absolutely have no other choice but to give up my position to a greater force and then to only bug out until I find a new defensible bug in position.
Similar here, I would only be laying up until I could get back into my home.