Foraging Fuel

[Barneyboy]

(7 September 2012, 21:01)Paul Wrote: That I'm hoping will be one of the beauties of a post apocalyptic world, you won't need money for tires, just a farm jack and a damn good wheel wrench.

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Still prefer a bit of speed though, how else are you going to out run the sheeple.

shot them

[bigpaul]

(7 September 2012, 21:01)Paul Wrote: That I'm hoping will be one of the beauties of a post apocalyptic world, you won't need money for tires, just a farm jack and a damn good wheel wrench.

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Still prefer a bit of speed though, how else are you going to out run the sheeple.

post SHTF why do we need fuel? after we've "done" all the supermarkets and stores etc. just where do you reckon we're all going??

[NorthernRaider]

Well if we are going to have any sort of sustainable future we will still need motorised transport like railways, so coal will be needed.
If we are to build and make PV panels, GS heat pumps, wind turbines we will need working factories and distribution systems.

[bigpaul]

(8 September 2012, 11:03)NorthernRaider Wrote: Well if we are going to have any sort of sustainable future we will still need motorised transport like railways, so coal will be needed.
If we are to build and make PV panels, GS heat pumps, wind turbines we will need working factories and distribution systems.

yes....thats later...when the dust settles and anyway thats commercial...i meant personally immediately post fall??

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once we've "done" all the supermarkets, the little shops, the filling stations, the farm shops and the empty houses and we've got all the supplies that are available in our areas...thats it there NEVER will be any more-it wont be replaced......my point is...where are we all supposed to be travelling to(that we need all this fuel)??

[Hrusai]

"doing" all the shops wont be as quick as you say though, if your looking at immediate post fall, and the cars wont be for speed per se, but for carrying ability, you can stock and move alot more food and other goods, things like solar panels and the like, with cars alot easier than by hand, i mean imagine carrying some solar panels 10 miles to your hidden encampment? whereas driving it quickly would be alot better, and if worried about noise you can stop very briefly to offload the goods to members of your group half a mile or so from your BOl and then you can just drive off again and make it sound like you were just stopped for vehicle maintenance or something park in a hidden places miles away from your BOL and hide your vehicle, sorted

[bigpaul]

(8 September 2012, 13:34)Hrusai Wrote: "doing" all the shops wont be as quick as you say though, if your looking at immediate post fall, and the cars wont be for speed per se, but for carrying ability, you can stock and move alot more food and other goods, things like solar panels and the like, with cars alot easier than by hand, i mean imagine carrying some solar panels 10 miles to your hidden encampment? whereas driving it quickly would be alot better, and if worried about noise you can stop very briefly to offload the goods to members of your group half a mile or so from your BOl and then you can just drive off again and make it sound like you were just stopped for vehicle maintenance or something park in a hidden places miles away from your BOL and hide your vehicle, sorted

nice thinking!....BUT the roads will be BLOCKED with refugees, the homeless and the starving..you'll be lucky if you get 5 miles before getting blocked, if your going to do these things you need to do them BEFORE TSHTF NOT AFTER.

[Paul]

The premise behind the thread was short term survivability not long term issues.

Come the expected European crash, and the UK's dive into destruction because of it, fuel is going to be vital.
I'm expecting no food, riots, no money, no power, no water, all the best bits of economic collapse yet I'm thinking that it will only last a short time. Probably no longer than 3-6 months.
Us preppers quietly chuckling away for having planned for this.

My thinking is that the global money men will sort it out because the longer it goes on for, the more they'll lose.
After all it's money that got us here, it's money that will get us out.
It certainly won't be good government because they'll be no money for taxation ergo they won't get paid.
I personally can't see any government minister working like stink for free to help us, can you? Can anybody!

So no electricity and no money will mean no fuel.
One silly comment by the government a while ago dried up the pumps for over a week. That was quite dramatic wasn't it?
Foraging for fuel will become the national pastime as no matter how much we might not like it, we'll still need to move round.

[bigpaul]

(8 September 2012, 13:52)Paul Wrote: The premise behind the thread was short term survivability not long term issues.

Come the expected European crash, and the UK's dive into destruction because of it, fuel is going to be vital.
I'm expecting no food, riots, no money, no power, no water, all the best bits of economic collapse yet I'm thinking that it will only last a short time. Probably no longer than 3-6 months.
Us preppers quietly chuckling away for having planned for this.

My thinking is that the global money men will sort it out because the longer it goes on for, the more they'll lose.
After all it's money that got us here, it's money that will get us out.
It certainly won't be good government because they'll be no money for taxation ergo they won't get paid.
I personally can't see any government minister working like stink for free to help us, can you? Can anybody!

So no electricity and no money will mean no fuel.
One silly comment by the government a while ago dried up the pumps for over a week. That was quite dramatic wasn't it?
Foraging for fuel will become the national pastime as no matter how much we might not like it, we'll still need to move round.

ah..i see! short term not TEOTWAWKI! that makes a difference! 3-6 months? hell ..we (meaning preppers) ought to be able to do that without even thinking about it..right??

[Paul]

Not without fuel!

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(8 September 2012, 09:27)NorthernRaider Wrote: Add nail varnish remover ( acetone) to improve the cetane rating, DO NOT try and improve the OCTANE rating you will blow up your engine.

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Folks add various stuff to bunker oil or veggie oil to make it run better in diesels, Parafin to stop it or ordinary diesel from waxing up, Acetone to make it burn better with less laquering, even a pint of petrol into a tank of diesel if its waxed up in the cold.

OK, I just need to know how much in the mix?

Anyone know if HDI modern motors can take this witches brew or should I keep on looking for an old banger?

[Skvez]

(8 September 2012, 14:37)Paul Wrote: Anyone know if HDI modern motors can take this witches brew or should I keep on looking for an old banger?

Running diesel engines on alternate fuel mixes is not a simple "yes/no" question.

Older diesels have lower fuel pressure and injectors with larger nozzle holes, these didn't atomise the fuel as well resulting in less complete burn and more nasty emissions. However these low pressure pumps and large injector nozzles are less affected by gumming up.
More modern diesel engines use very very high common rail pressures and very small injector nozzles which atomise the fuel better for cleaner burn but unfortunately these systems gum up more easily if the fuel isn't ideal.
Seals and pumps also experience faster wear from some alternate fuel mixes even if the engine can still run.
Whether or not you can run your engine on a particular mix isn't easy to answer.
In most cases you can run it at least for a while but you are probably aging the engine or at least some of the engine components at an accelerated rate.

There are lots and lots of articles about this on the web.

If you're trying to get to your BOL and you're out of diesel you've nothing to loose since your vehicle isn't any use to you abandoned on the road. If you get another 100 miles but wreck the engine what do you care, you're 100 miles closer to your BOL.
However if you wanted to keep the vehicle operable you may want to be cautious about alternate fuels into your engine.