Unintended Consequences?

[CharlesHarris]

Gun control in Britain passed in stages, beginning just after World War I and continuing in a reactionary fashion with increasing strictness through the 1990s.

When the final stage arrived in 1997, and virtually all handguns were banned via the Firearms Act, the promise was a reduction in crime and greater safety for the British people. But the result was the emergence of Britain as the "most violent country in Europe." ...The Firearm Act of 1997 was passed while emotions ran high. Gun control proponents push for an all-out ban on private gun ownership, in the much the same way that Senator Dianne Feinstein (D-CA) reacted to the heinous crime at Sandy Hook Elementary by trying to ban approximately 150 different guns... In 2009, twelve years after the Firearms Act of 1997 was passed, Daily Mail Online reported that Britain was "the most violent country in Europe." They also reported that Britain's home figures showed "the UK [had] a worse rate for all types of violence than the U.S. and South Africa." (The chart accompanying this article shows not only the number of violent crimes but also the rate per 100,000 residents. On top of that, there have been numerous reports that British cops have been pressured to “massage” their reports to reduce the official rates of violent crime.)

http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Peace/2014/...-In-Europe

[Devonian]

But it is a fact that Gun Related Murders (Homicides) in the UK are some of the lowest in the World

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cou...death_rate

As are all murders regardless of the weapon:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cou...icide_rate

[Mortblanc]

If you want me to change that I can go edit Wikipedia for you!

[Devonian]

(25 September 2014, 23:07)Mortblanc Wrote: If you want me to change that I can go edit Wikipedia for you!

Why would you do that?

I've only just reworded it to say what I want

But on a serious matter, the definition and classification of Violent Crimes in the US and UK are also completely different, many of the crimes that are classed as being violent in the UK, are placed under different classifications in the US, so it's pretty much impossible to make comparisons.

[bigpaul]

"gun" crimes are very few in this country and are noticeable when they do occur because of that, most crimes with a weapon are mostly knives and other bladed weapons. most seem to be gang related.

[Tigs]

you also have to look at the newspaper its from . the daily mail is know in the UK as a bit of a scaremonger! with stories such as immigrants are swamping the us /taking all our jobs/are all terrorists in disguise/ scrounging benefits ,new pandemics will kill us all in a week, bird flu found in chicken nuggets, red meat kills faster than cyanide etc
look at the isle of man were gun control is not as strict as the rest of the UK and they have even less violent crime , its been said it all comes down to how you see violent crime , in the UK a fist fight will be added to the figures were as in the USA or rest of Europe it might not be, were violent crime might have to involve a weapon

[Mortblanc]

Yes, you folks get a very sensationalized view of the US.

One of our major statistical jokes is that the highest rates of violent crime are in the urban areas where gun control is the most strict.

I live in an urban area where every household is armed and our crime rate is almost zero.

We claim it is because everyone knows everyone else is armed and therefore minds their manners. In the city where GC is strict there is no fear of self defense and the criminals are bold.

And you folks do not count things we do in both directions. If you guys had to count whining until everyone around you slit their wrists in frustration as a violent crime your murder rates would be higher than ours.

---

Sorry, but I meant to say that I lived in a rural area, although in my region even the cities are less strict.

My state specifically prevents local governments from passing their own restrictive GC laws just to keep the crime rate down.

[Straight Shooter]

Dunblaine Scotland...children killed in a school.........sound familiar to you over the pond........ the founding fathers gave you the rights to bear arms.......sandy hook ....and all the rest is the way your gov will try to strip away your rights ....same as the UK gov did.....problem.....reaction.......soluion ......in the USA there are loads of vets....if I was a cop .....I would not want to come up against anyone with a gun .....and against a vet who has been well trained.....you can f... right off ! Thank you very much.?

[Scythe13]

I'd rather live in the US! The gun is the great equaliser.

In the UK if a guy wants to mug grandma, he can just go and do it. In the US, grandma pulls out a gun, as does grandma's friends. Suddenly the frail and old become self-protected.

Why do the massacres happen in gun free zones?

Why do the people causing them all take medication that has noticeable side effects, e.g. psychosis?

Why has nobody tried to bust into a gun toting area of Texas and tried to shoot a load of people?

Why do the areas with the most legally owned guns have the lowest overall crime rate?


The truth is that in the UK we're massively more likely to be caught up (as in become a 'victim') in a crime, especially a violent crime, than out cousins in the US are to be involved in a crime (as a victim); especially a violent crime in the US. The US is statistically much safer than the UK. Granted the odds of getting shot in the US are much higher than in the UK. But you're so much more likely to be victim of ANY violent crime in the UK.

Odds of dying from a gun in the US, very very low.
Odds of dying from a gun in the UK, very very very low.

Odds of being a victim of violent crime in the US, very very low.
Odds of being a victim of violent crime in the UK, very very high.

We'll add one more statistic, made simple, for fun...odds of being a victim of a shooting in the US in a heavily gun populated area...near enough zero!

Let's not even start talking about what happens if you beat the crap out of the person trying to mug you...UK - you get arrested for defending yourself. US - the police buy you a Happy Meal and the local newspaper says you're awesome.

[Devonian]

(26 September 2014, 18:46)Scythe13 Wrote: In the UK if a guy wants to mug grandma, he can just go and do it. In the US, grandma pulls out a gun, as does grandma's friends. Suddenly the frail and old become self-protected. Except in the US, you're more likely to be mugged or car jacked by a gang of gun wielding desperados

Why do the massacres happen in gun free zones? They can happen anywhere

Why do the people causing them all take medication that has noticeable side effects, e.g. psychosis? True

Why has nobody tried to bust into a gun toting area of Texas and tried to shoot a load of people? They have:

Texas has been the site of some of the deadliest mass shootings of the past 50 years. Here is a list of the worst mass shootings in Texas history:

1. Oct. 16, 1991: A deadly shooting rampage took place in Killeen, Texas, as George Hennard opened fire at a Luby’s Cafeteria, killing 23 people before taking his own life. 20 others were wounded in the attack.

2 .Aug. 1, 1966: Charles Whitman opened fire from the clock tower at the University of Texas at Austin, killing 16 people and wounding 31.

3. Nov. 5, 2009: Thirteen soldiers and civilians were killed and more than two dozen wounded when a gunman walked into the Soldier Readiness Processing Center at Fort Hood, Texas, and opened fire. Army psychiatrist Maj. Nidal Hasan is charged with 13 counts of premeditated murder and 32 counts of attempted premeditated murder.

4. Sept. 15, 1999: Seven people were killed and seven others injured when a gunman opened fire inside a crowded chapel at Fort Worth’s Wedgewood Baptist Church. Some worshipers believed that Larry Gene Ashbrook was pulling a prank and continued singing after the shooting began. The murderer killed himself.

http://blog.chron.com/txpotomac/2012/12/...s-history/


Why do the areas with the most legally owned guns have the lowest overall crime rate? Don't know, but it probably has more to do with poverty levels in the respective communities.

The truth is that in the UK we're massively more likely to be caught up (as in become a 'victim') in a crime, especially a violent crime, than out cousins in the US are to be involved in a crime (as a victim); especially a violent crime in the US. The US is statistically much safer than the UK. Granted the odds of getting shot in the US are much higher than in the UK. But you're so much more likely to be victim of ANY violent crime in the UK.

Odds of dying from a gun in the US, very very low.
Odds of dying from a gun in the UK, very very very low.

Odds of being a victim of violent crime in the US, very very low.
Odds of being a victim of violent crime in the UK, very very high. Really, I'm not convinced.

We'll add one more statistic, made simple, for fun...odds of being a victim of a shooting in the US in a heavily gun populated area...near enough zero!

Let's not even start talking about what happens if you beat the crap out of the person trying to mug you...UK - you get arrested for defending yourself. US - the police buy you a Happy Meal and the local newspaper says you're awesome. Agreed!