Hygiene protocols

[bigpaul]

there is also the problem of resupply. if a SHTF/survival type event i.e, it ISNT over in 5 minutes all back to normal type scenario, no power, no fuel, no transport say, no new supplies getting into the shops-where are you going to get fresh supplies of chemicals, no matter how much you stock at some point in time you WILL use it all up...what then? no more chemicals so we all turn our toes up and succumb to the next bug that comes along-goodbye human race??

[preservefreak]

(28 July 2012, 11:57)bigpaul Wrote: the trouble with killing EVERY microbe and bug by dousing it in chemicals is firstly there are good as well as bad microbes and secondly you have to get a miniscule dose of the microbe or bug for your immune system to kick in.

Yes there are good microbes but frankly they are unlikely to be found on my poultry chopping board. If you want to get a minuscule dose of e coli, salmonella or campylobacter BP I suggest you do so now while there are still hospitals to save your life.

In a post collapse situation that chicken you just killed will have at least one of them. Cooking will kill the nasties but you can't cook your work surface or your chopping board so sanitizing them is what I will be doing every time I finish working with raw poultry and fish. It is in fact what I do now.

(28 July 2012, 13:16)bigpaul Wrote: there is also the problem of resupply. if a SHTF/survival type event i.e, it ISNT over in 5 minutes all back to normal type scenario, no power, no fuel, no transport say, no new supplies getting into the shops-where are you going to get fresh supplies of chemicals, no matter how much you stock at some point in time you WILL use it all up...what then? no more chemicals so we all turn our toes up and succumb to the next bug that comes along-goodbye human race??

Yes storing enough bleach ( I assume that's what you're referring to when you say chemicals) is difficult in liquid form but you can get sodium hypochlorite which mixed with water will give you years of bleach. Then we'll have to rely on distilled alcohol or vinegar.

Just to clear something up, good sanitation practises don't make super bugs. Over use of antibiotics and antibacterial soap is responsible for those and even super bugs die from having their water ripped out of them.

[Hrusai]

superbugs have existed for millions of years, we've found them frozen in antarticas ice its the problem with current antibiotics, they're all derived from natural products, meaning that bacteria have had thousands if not millions of years to evolve immunity, this immunity lies latent in a small part of the population, and when we start to use the antibiotics and such like we wipe out almost all of that bacteria, apart from those that have the immunity genes, this small group then rapidly multiply and create a new population that has the immunity, if we created entirely new totally synthetic anti-biotics these would last for a very long amount of time before any bacteria evolve immunity to them.

otherwise heat and pure alcohol will easily take care of any sterilisation needs both before TSHTF and after and is reasonably easy to make...not to mention its useful for relaxation

i also agree with the whole too much cleaning is a bad thing, its the reason that allergies and such like are becoming much more commonplace, humanities newfound obsession with overcleaning is certainly a bad thing.

however after an event it'll be almost impossible to achieve such surgical levels of cleanliness, therefore having stringent standards of sanitation will be a good thing, but you cant expect to make things as clean as you would like to in an ideal setting.

personally im just going to rely on pure alcohol and home-made soap and water, clean all tools fairly regularly wash as often as possible and make sure all food and water is thoroughly cooked and sanitised, do all that and you can't go wrong.

[Skean Dhude]

I look at it as simply as this. Our stores will enable us to migrate to a new way of living. As discussed we will have to change our hygiene techniques, less bleach and more washing while our bodies adapt to new germs. It isn't perfect, some will die if they get it wrong, hell, even if they get it right things can go wrong.

We did fine without bleach for thousands of years, it is only in the last 2 thousand that we used this stuff and look how quickly we adapted to need it. Fingers crossed we adapt quickly back.

[Hrusai]

couldnt agree more SD right on all counts ...ive always been outdoors getting dirty and the like and ive been ill alot less frequently than most people i know, we adapt to such things well...as your signature says, the most adaptable survive.

[Nemesis]

I speak for myself now and I feel in the beginning of a shtf event I am going to go along the lines of full on hygiene and only after time shall I lower the bar, I have prepped enough to manage to do this and suggest others do so to, it don't cost much.

We are not talking bugs from woodlands or catching poor little tommys cold, we are talking about an environment that will no longer receive the maintenance that once keep all the nasty’s at bay, un-flushed sewage, rubbish and dead things rotting we can assume full hygiene protocol must be in place.

[Lightspeed]

(27 July 2012, 18:28)bigpaul Wrote:

(27 July 2012, 17:51)Lightspeed Wrote:

(27 July 2012, 16:42)Skvez Wrote: Hygiene is important and with the increased stress and probably reduced nutrition of a post-event our immune systems will suffer but this reads like you're afraid you're going to die if you get a speck of dirt on you.

Cleaning the home to the standard of an operating theatre!? You've got to be joking, who has the time or resources to do this today before TSHTF let alone after? The golden horde will be able to find you from the smell of bleach

Skvez has got a point here, and its maybe something we should consider in our prepping.

Too much cleaning is actually bad for you.

On a trans African rally I took part in many years ago, there was one car that adopted a stringent hygene regime. Hands washed all the time, all fruit completely scrubbed before being eaten, only taking cooked meals at recognizably western managed hotels etc..... And who do you think had the shits the whole time.....of couse it was these guys.

As the saying goed, you gotta eat a bit of shit before you die..... maybe we should be prepping our personal immune systems to deal with the poor hygene and sanitation that will prevail after an event?

i think its"eat a peck of DIRT before you die" i was recently VERY ill with "the trots" , it happened very quickly and lasted for 12 days( almost non stop) and i dont think it was because i was particularly dirty or because i didnt wash my hands enough, it was just that this particular "bug" was in this area(about an 8 mile radius of where i live) and lots of people were affected, because it was a virus anti biotics were not prescribed and i just had to wait it out until it had run its course.

I stand corrected TL.

Hope you're OK now. Viral infections are a huge risk, especially to us when we are run down and isolated. Then again, isolation wil educe the transmision to some extent.

LS

[bigpaul]

(28 July 2012, 21:57)WetandCold Wrote: I speak for myself now and I feel in the beginning of a shtf event I am going to go along the lines of full on hygiene and only after time shall I lower the bar, I have prepped enough to manage to do this and suggest others do so to, it don't cost much.

We are not talking bugs from woodlands or catching poor little tommys cold, we are talking about an environment that will no longer receive the maintenance that once keep all the nasty’s at bay, un-flushed sewage, rubbish and dead things rotting we can assume full hygiene protocol must be in place.

we can deal with things like raw sewage, rubbish and dead things rotting on a personal level by composting or burning, i agree with NR on the burning of bandages and not bringing work clothes into the kitchen, and it makes sense that some one cleaning out a cess pit or a river dosent come into the kitchen, its just the excessive use of chemicals i have problems with, like i say its the storing and resupply of such chemicals that may eventually be a problem for us all.

[bigpaul]

http://thegarlicfarm.co.uk/garlichealth.aspx

[bigpaul]

(29 July 2012, 11:57)bigpaul Wrote: http://thegarlicfarm.co.uk/garlichealth.aspx

http://homecooking.about.com/od/foodheal...health.htm