Starting to get "it"

[NorthernRaider]

Hi Tarrel, Yes I think in general you are correct

But more accurately my meaning was " You can lead a horse to water but its wrong to try and tell it that its thirsty, its better to let it decide for itself "

[bigpaul]

I wasn't going to get involved in this but what the hell?? why is it that just because the majority of people only prep for the short term events that John (and I ) are considered to be so wrong? why is it that a complete collapse of society and a return to if not the stone age then something like a pre industrial age say around the early 1700s just cannot and will not be tolerated or discussed but is poo-pooed and talking down. is it because this is such an enormous reversal of everything we know? I understand the sheeple's attitude but as preppers and survivalists shouldn't we consider ALL options and not just the "popular" ones?? or is it so awful to contemplate that we just don't talk about it?

[NorthernRaider]

I don't think you are wrong BP and I have told you that very often, I greatly respect your beliefs and your expertise in traditional and ancient crafts, I just don't think its something I want to plan for because with my limited resources I cannot afford to do so, BUT I did totally accept and adopt your points years ago about the vulnerability of "" Normal"" back up heating and cooking systems such as my bottled gas heaters and cookers and on YOUR advice I fitted a traditional wood and coal burning stove, on YOUR guidance we scrapped our Aluminium pots and pans and bought cast iron and stainless steel pots, equally (and you know that I have) we have totally embraced the wisdom and advice on homeopathic and natural medications, And Mon Ami I'm pretty sure you persuaded us not so long back about the benefit of native small horses like the Dartmoor ponies etC????

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Thanks for the nice words in the other place BP.

[Devonian]

(14 December 2014, 11:28)bigpaul Wrote: I wasn't going to get involved in this but what the hell?? why is it that just because the majority of people only prep for the short term events that John (and I ) are considered to be so wrong? why is it that a complete collapse of society and a return to if not the stone age then something like a pre industrial age say around the early 1700s just cannot and will not be tolerated or discussed but is poo-pooed and talking down. is it because this is such an enormous reversal of everything we know? I understand the sheeple's attitude but as preppers and survivalists shouldn't we consider ALL options and not just the "popular" ones?? or is it so awful to contemplate that we just don't talk about it?

Personally, I think that the majority of people on SUK (unlike other forums) prep for most types of events, be they short term or major EOTWAWKI events, but at the same time, there are "likely" (although this is not guaranteed) to be multiple short term/small events before any major event.

And I don't generally see people poo-pooing your ideas or talking you down, but we do of course all have different ideas about things and view things in different ways, if we didn't we'd all be drones and this forum would have died years ago.

But......and hopefully John takes this as constructive criticism in that John does tend to come on here, with very strongly held views which he seems to portray as being fact or the only way it could ever be, and then when others disagree or have a different opinion, he cannot appreciate or even understand that the views of others could be equally valid. To me this is a dangerous way to be as such entranced views just illustrate a closed mind and inflexible approach to issues which could in the very circumstances to which he alludes, result in him getting himself into serious strife.

[bigpaul]

yeah, well we all put our foot in it from time to time-me included. and I get bloody frustrated sometimes at the lack of what I call foresight, it seems every site I have ever been on in the last 5 years they all bang on about short term events and stuff but nobody seems to even consider the long term implications. I am currently reading "the grid down prepper" by Robert Paine, not much more than pamphlett really but it talks about a power down future, I mean I read somewhere if something blew all the transformers in the power grid, oh I don't know an EMP or a solar flare or something like that say, it would take years to replace all the transformers as it takes such a long time to make each one, that's even if they could find all the engineers to do the work and they would need thousands on a national scale. but something like this and following on about societal collapse that it never or hardly ever gets talked about and not in any great depth, seems its not something anyone wants to contemplate so it dosent get discussed. I tend to look at more long term stuff, stuff like unemployment, illness, divorce, power cuts and even trade union strikes are something I call normal life and I have lived through many times before and I really don't give a second thought anymore.

[bigpaul]

re Solar Storms http://rt.com/news/solar-storm-earth-electricity-391/ please note: if new transformers were needed "the lead in time would be a MINIMUM of 5 months".

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and "replacement could take up to 2 YEARS".

[Midnitemo]

I'm probably going to put my foot in it now....all the modern advances made since the industrial revolution won't just be miraculously forgotten...people will survive with the skill's and knowledge to reinstate some of these thing's(may take a while and it may be a little agricultural/basic).....but thing's will progress towards a more comfortable/advanced way of life quite quickly after thing's have settled down....the genie is out of the bottle and it can't be unlearn't or forgotten that easily whilst people like SD are compiling reference libraries...man strives for bigger better faster more...it's an inherent trait of the species...mass production and consumerism will be gone but technology & innovation will thrive in a cottage industry kind of way......still going to get some self suffiency skill's and tool's/book's/seeds etc just in case.

[Devonian]

(14 December 2014, 15:11)Midnitemo Wrote: I'm probably going to put my foot in it now....all the modern advances made since the industrial revolution won't just be miraculously forgotten...people will survive with the skill's and knowledge to reinstate some of these thing's(may take a while and it may be a little agricultural/basic).....but thing's will progress towards a more comfortable/advanced way of life quite quickly after thing's have settled down....the genie is out of the bottle and it can't be unlearn't or forgotten that easily whilst people like SD are compiling reference libraries...man strives for bigger better faster more...it's an inherent trait of the species...mass production and consumerism will be gone but technology & innovation will thrive in a cottage industry kind of way......still going to get some self suffiency skill's and tool's/book's/seeds etc just in case.

Not putting your foot in it at all, that's exactly how I also see it.

http://forum.survivaluk.net/showthread.php?tid=7454