Connunications update following Polls:

[Lightspeed]

(30 October 2012, 17:01)gary5wift Wrote: I just signed up to do the foundation license with my local ham group but i am hoping to progress into HF and CW once I've got the foundation under my belt. For anyone wanting to learn morse there is a good SW program that you can download for free called MorseCat - just google it to find the link.

Maybe we'll touchbase on air sometime

Cheer
Gary

Good luck with the FL Gary,

73 de

Lightspeed

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(30 October 2012, 20:33)Paul Wrote: What do I mean by that?

Voice wins every time over Morse especially when talking to strangers in a crisis.

Of course the hams among us will rightly state that Morse carries further than voice. It does.

Your problem might be getting someone down the road to pull you out of a ditch and stop the severe bleeding rather than talking round the world to a fellow ham.

Try sending Morse in a vehicle, lying on your side.
It's going to be easier to key a mic and scream "somebody help me" than establish a Morse key link and gently transmit your location at 8 words a minute.

Time yourself.
Send in Morse to a friend:-
Stuck in a ditch by the oak tree, 3 miles west of Cliff road, a village, a town, a county, TW10 1AA for a GPS fix.
I've severely cut my wrist and am bleeding out, come quick.

I'm working on say 150 characters at five characters a word, 30 words.
8 words a minute, about 4 minutes.
Wow that's fast (not).

Now go onto a microphone and say the same thing.
What, 15 seconds at the most?

IMO you need to concentrate on getting PHYSICAL help and that means plain language short range communications.

PMR, VHF Ham, CB, Marine. It doesn't matter.
Voice rules in emergencies and short range comms should be your goal.

Morse? How quaint.

Welcome back OM.

I completely agree with everything you have said here.
Agreed phone ( voice) is the best for summoning immediate help and for most open communication.

Morse is really of use when looking for wider area communications, using low power and simple technology equipment.

[Paul]

Hi LS.
Good to be back.
Hope the xyl is well.
Got to take issue with range, power, and simplicity though.

Low power to me means what to takes to power something?
My new 12 watt SSB CB draws 2.2 amps on transmit and me screaming into the mic (110% modulation).
Standby, 0.35 amps.
Change to AM, 4 watts, 0.85 amps.

Simple technology?
Don't get much simpler than a CB set the ultimate transceiver.
No pratting round with frequencies, simple channel switch.
Bit fiddly with a Delta tune for SSB but that's familiarization for you.

Off the shelf consumer product as found almost everywhere in Europe.
Cheap too, mail order, 60 Euros (£48).
Thus avoiding UK rip off pricing.

Range?
Want to talk further than mainland UK or Europe in your case? Why?
I know I endlessly keep on banging on about it (probably boring you all to death) but communications in an emergency is predominately used to SUMMON HELP and maintain contact with your base / group. Not for social long range 'chit chat'.

10 miles good comms is my goal.
10 miles is 3-4 hours walking or 15 (ish) mins in a car.
Anything else is too far and would arrive too late if at all.

I really must change this record I keep playing, it's wearing out!

73's
Paul.

[PrepperJohn]

Why limit yourself to one type of radio.

I have CB in my truck and at base and BOL, I have a dual band hand held ham radio and I am working towards building a qrp set for longer distance comms

[NorthernRaider]

(31 October 2012, 14:21)PrepperJohn Wrote: Why limit yourself to one type of radio.

MONEY.

[Paul]

well said that man.

[PrepperJohn]

I bought a job lot of CB radios at a roadside house clearance for £15. There were 3 scanners, 3 CBs SWR meters and various other bits of kit.

I have a Baofeng dual band radio which I think are about £40 from Sinotel

You can build Single band QRP transceivers for £30

Chuck up a long wire and use a simple ATU and you have some sort of long range communications.

I treat my radio hobby like I treat all of my pepping. I don't have the money to spend on fancy kit so I learn how to do without it.

[NorthernRaider]

So far I have managed to buy only one Intek H520 dual band CB / Ham radio, it does 26 to 30 megz thats bands 10 and 11 I believe. I'm not wanting to get multiple rigs for different roles cos I'm skint.

[Lightspeed]

Hi Paul.

Good to have you back mate.

XYL and I are fine thanks. I think she’s enjoying being Mrs lightspeed :-) …well she hasn’t complained yet anyway.

Yes, as was mentioned COST is an issue and different radios are for different tasks.

CB / PMR / Marine / & Ham 2m / 70 cms are best for the close in stuff, and I fully support your statement that that CB is the way to go for prepper local comms.

Under exceptional conditions the standard FM CBs will indeed gat you heard way out into Europe. But such conditions are not very reliable and are truly exceptional. 12w SSb CB will do better but Price points are then over £120

In defense of Morse operating:

Use:
Mine’s intended to be used where CB cannot reliably do the job. Its for when I want to reliably communicate over 100 to 1000 miles. This is not for day to day operational / tactical comms of course, rather for keeping in touch with geographically dispersed groups and individuals ( assuming they have the skills to operate and have compatible equipment of course)

Compared to your CB specifications, such a radio is even more simple.

Low Power:
• My, low power rig, an SW-40, draws 0.4 amps on transmit
Standby, 0.016 amps. ( 12v supply)
Simple technology?
• Fifty odd through-hole soldered components, and a couple of ICs. If something fails I can fix it ( usually)
• Only two controls one for tuning, the other for volume.
• Size: Mine’s built into a very durable alloy box a little bigger than a packet of cigarettes
Cost
• Similar price to a CB too at around (£50). But it’s a kit so you have to add the build time and a few more components to your cost

Range?

• UK to Europe, no problem at all.
• USA, Asia and Africa all very do-able
• Local NVIS when conditions are right from 10 miles out to around 400 miles
• Very local line of sight out to 5 or 6 miles

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Simple Morse Capable Radio

Here's a pic of an SW-40

Minimalist in every way

[OpSecRadio]

Thanks for all your responses and info - all good stuff and all very welcome.

There is no one size fits all solution. My plan is to have a wide range of options as cheaply as possible.

Already have a marine radio - had it years from when I used to go sailing before wife had a stroke.
Already have an old CB - had it about 20 years but it still works ok.
Already have 4 PMR446 sets from when we used to take the kids walking and camping
Already have a Baofeng Dual Band transceiver (VHF/UHF) - cost me £30 off ebay a couple of weeks ago
Want to have a go at building a HF set for CW/morse eventually. I've been told that a functional set can be built at little cost.

Getting the Ham license gives me the opportunity to learn more about radio comms and the option to practise using the Baofeng and eventually the CW/morse without incurring the wrath of Ofcom etc. I know that I still have a lot to learn

This is a good thread with lots of useful info - thanks for all the hard work you guys have put into it. I'll keep reading and hope to learn as much as possible.

Cheers
Gary

[Paul]

Very nice, rather twee, does it come in flame red?
Is it easy to mount in a Mini?
What do you do with 15 meters of aerial wire at 60 mph?
Does it come with a hands free Morse key?


Two different disciplines we're discussing here mate.

You know what I do for radio fun but this is me in practical emergency procedures mode.
I'm try to preach emergency gear for STHF times.
Common gear, CHEAP gear, easy to set up and use.

I'm aiming at the unskilled guys and girls not the ticketed hams.
Although a lot of the newly qualified one day wonders don't even know how to wire up a three pin plug. (Wow how bitchy is that!)
Must be the freebander in me.

CB Channel 9 (US) exploded when Sandy hit.
The CB internet feeds were awash with 10.33 (calls for help).
I'm pretty sure REACT US (the Ham rescue services for those who don't know what REACT is) would have been active but as I don't listen to them, I can't comment.

In one 20 minute session I counted over 30 thirty 10.33 calls and replies.

What's the odds of the UK ham world doing that?
I mean answering normal citizens calls for help and responding?
Nil, less than nil?
The reason I can say that is it's two different worlds.
Hams don't often mix with CB'ers especially in the UK.

So does that mean that CB is the answer in the UK.
At this moment probably not except if every prepper was CB capable, you're odds improve as CB is still out there being used by all manner of people.

Hams?
Well they talk to hams mostly about bacon prices I believe.

Boy my freebanding mentality is shining today.