So what use are the "old folks" when TSHTF?

[Jonas]

Interesting letter posted on James Rawles' http://www.survivalblog.com gives a good reason to respect the old folks should civilization go "tango-uniform" and we find ourselves on the wrong side of a totalitarian government... JP

http://www.survivalblog.com/2013/06/thre...ics-1.html

Sir,

The post on "studying" Guerilla War tactics brought to mind a subject that I have been considering for some time. Like many, my training and experience was many years ago. Though my body has grown slightly less than optimal my spirit and mind are what they once were and more as an added measure of wisdom has been granted to me.

The question I have been pondering is to ask, what role to those of us who have reached the age of reason have to play in a possible future resistance? We are not able to handle the physical challenges efficiently yet have the experience and knowledge stored that would assist the success of such endeavors.

I have read Max Velocity's book and many other books, articles and posts over the last few years. Many of those in the marketplace of ideas appear to me to be the products of armchair warriors who never heard a shot fired in anger, but who have strong opinions and fair writing skills. Max Velocity is not one of the armchair variety. I can not specifically nail down why I know this but can only say that when you know you know.

I believe however, that even from some of these armchair folks, things of value can be gleaned, and I will not detract from their efforts except for the few who would upon implementation of their advice get a lot of good people killed without value. I'll leave the details to another time, though I suspect that you and many others with actual experience in the storm see them for what they are as well.

My conclusions are based on observations of history. Old men may not be able to run twenty miles and fight or evade an enemy force in a northern plains winter but we still have value to a potential resistance. In Southeast Asia and many other conflicts in time and about the world it was the old men who provided the philosophical foundation of a resistance. Without coherent reasons as an underlayment, a movement will wither and die. The problem to avoid is a philosophy that compromises true value for the sake of expedience and experiments with the lives of young men. Those who take this role need to be people who have lived what they speak of.

Old men and women provided the Intelligence network for much of the Viet Cong's network. Shop and stall keepers in the cities and towns and the village elders and headmen out in the bush provided the eyes and ears of the guerilla fighters. Men with experience in combat will know what information is useful and how to transmit it. They will be very likely able to set up the networks required. Many good men and their families were executed by the Viet Cong because they would not fill this function for them, instead they worked with our forces. Tragic as this is, it is a good lesson in the value of information networks run by old men and women.

Wounded can be sent to outlying farms to be cared for by the elderly as well as active troops scattered to farms as labourers disguising their true nature. Food supplies and caches of equipment can be concealed and managed by old men and women in cities as well as on the farms. A lot of fighters in African conflicts survived on food and equipment cached by villagers out in the bush. There are many ingenious ways of doing this. Young fighters need food & medical supplies as much as they need ammo.

I think that one of the most valuable assets that old war horses bring is tactical knowledge and training. Knowing how to approach an enemy, how to engage and how to escape and evade afterwards is paramount to success. Young men's eagerness can often lead them into the jaws of a trap or violate the principals that keep a population on the side of insurgents. Old men teach and moderate this tendency in the young.

Like many, I see dark days and see the handwriting on the wall. There is a storm coming. Don't write off an old man because he walks with a cane and takes a long time to pass water. What he carries in his head and his heart is as valuable as a weapon and as useful as a well stocked medical kit.

George in the Upper Midwest

[bigpaul]

define "old"!

[Tibbs735]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NZ39lS3LOIE
This is a good video on the subject of old people related to preparedness. It's a shame that the people who lived through the Great Depression are becoming rare when we are approaching another one.

[Skean Dhude]

(3 June 2013, 17:05)Tibbs735 Wrote: It's a shame that the people who lived through the Great Depression are becoming rare when we are approaching another one.

That is part of the reason that we are approaching another. The people running things don't have any first hand knowledge of what it is like and are stupid enough to think they have the skills to avoid one.

[bigpaul]

didn't you know SD, this present lot were told at school that they were destined to run the country, dosent mean they actually have the skills to do it.most of them have never had a REAL job just politics and don't know how the ordinary people live.

[Barneyboy]

(3 June 2013, 16:14)Jonas Wrote: Interesting letter posted on James Rawles' http://www.survivalblog.com gives a good reason to respect the old folks should civilization go "tango-uniform" and we find ourselves on the wrong side of a totalitarian government... JP

http://www.survivalblog.com/2013/06/thre...ics-1.html

Sir,

The post on "studying" Guerilla War tactics brought to mind a subject that I have been considering for some time. Like many, my training and experience was many years ago. Though my body has grown slightly less than optimal my spirit and mind are what they once were and more as an added measure of wisdom has been granted to me.

The question I have been pondering is to ask, what role to those of us who have reached the age of reason have to play in a possible future resistance? We are not able to handle the physical challenges efficiently yet have the experience and knowledge stored that would assist the success of such endeavors.

I have read Max Velocity's book and many other books, articles and posts over the last few years. Many of those in the marketplace of ideas appear to me to be the products of armchair warriors who never heard a shot fired in anger, but who have strong opinions and fair writing skills. Max Velocity is not one of the armchair variety. I can not specifically nail down why I know this but can only say that when you know you know.

I believe however, that even from some of these armchair folks, things of value can be gleaned, and I will not detract from their efforts except for the few who would upon implementation of their advice get a lot of good people killed without value. I'll leave the details to another time, though I suspect that you and many others with actual experience in the storm see them for what they are as well.

My conclusions are based on observations of history. Old men may not be able to run twenty miles and fight or evade an enemy force in a northern plains winter but we still have value to a potential resistance. In Southeast Asia and many other conflicts in time and about the world it was the old men who provided the philosophical foundation of a resistance. Without coherent reasons as an underlayment, a movement will wither and die. The problem to avoid is a philosophy that compromises true value for the sake of expedience and experiments with the lives of young men. Those who take this role need to be people who have lived what they speak of.

Old men and women provided the Intelligence network for much of the Viet Cong's network. Shop and stall keepers in the cities and towns and the village elders and headmen out in the bush provided the eyes and ears of the guerilla fighters. Men with experience in combat will know what information is useful and how to transmit it. They will be very likely able to set up the networks required. Many good men and their families were executed by the Viet Cong because they would not fill this function for them, instead they worked with our forces. Tragic as this is, it is a good lesson in the value of information networks run by old men and women.

Wounded can be sent to outlying farms to be cared for by the elderly as well as active troops scattered to farms as labourers disguising their true nature. Food supplies and caches of equipment can be concealed and managed by old men and women in cities as well as on the farms. A lot of fighters in African conflicts survived on food and equipment cached by villagers out in the bush. There are many ingenious ways of doing this. Young fighters need food & medical supplies as much as they need ammo.

I think that one of the most valuable assets that old war horses bring is tactical knowledge and training. Knowing how to approach an enemy, how to engage and how to escape and evade afterwards is paramount to success. Young men's eagerness can often lead them into the jaws of a trap or violate the principals that keep a population on the side of insurgents. Old men teach and moderate this tendency in the young.

Like many, I see dark days and see the handwriting on the wall. There is a storm coming. Don't write off an old man because he walks with a cane and takes a long time to pass water. What he carries in his head and his heart is as valuable as a weapon and as useful as a well stocked medical kit.

George in the Upper Midwest

they can be food ,yumyum roasted wrinkly

[Franc]

good for worm farming as well.

[Sunna]

what worries me come shtf what would happen to all the care homes ,when all the staff are missing or at home .
living in one of those places would be like hell on earth come shtf ......
any ideas ....?

[NorthernRaider]

(3 June 2013, 21:44)Sunna Wrote: what worries me come shtf what would happen to all the care homes ,when all the staff are missing or at home .
living in one of those places would be like hell on earth come shtf ......
any ideas ....?

I thought this very issue of granny farms was superbly addressed in the PA fictional novel One Second After by William R Forshen. roughly most of the wrinklies and medicine dependant including the books hero main characters daughter die out.

I think granny farms, sheltered accomodation, prisons, and many residential areas full of welfare dependant folks will quickly become charnel houses of epic proportions. Who is going to look after the senile, the demented the BSA and Cruetzfeld Jacobs disease sufferers. Who is going to pander to the housebound clinically obese and type 2 diabetics (and sadly the kids with type 1) Even the grannies who rely on meals on wheels and visting carers are going to be abandoned not to mention those poor bastards in our already flthy hospitals who cannot get out..... shudder.

[Highlander]

(3 June 2013, 17:05)Tibbs735 Wrote: It's a shame that the people who lived through the Great Depression are becoming rare when we are approaching another one.

I agree with the above, it is a pity, they have the perfect insight into our biggest problems.

.... but many of us can still look back to our childhoods and know how our parents had to manage, many of us have come from poor backgrounds where `having to make do`, would make most modern folk cringe,... some of us were born to prepers, its just that as we grew up we didnt bother to keep up the skills, or life simply got too soft

Its only now that the older folk can look back on the `good old days` and remember a lot of the skills and ideas that we now need once again