Where Most Prepping Falls Short:

[Straight Shooter]

Good points Dev and NR ......i mentioned BP .....the only flaw (in my view) is the expected sheeple will give up and just die off and because of his location they will not make it to his location ....i cannot except this way of thinking or reason...but saying that i do agree with a lot of stuff that BP says....i would like to point out , i use BP as a example on the pure fact this is how i perceive him, and no other reason...and the thread fits with my view of BP and Kenneth come to that.

[Devonian]

(30 November 2014, 22:19)Steve Wrote: I fail to understand those who think we will be transported back to the stone age. A knowledge of edible plants is obviously useful, I've mentioned before that growing edible plants that most people don't recognize is a smart strategy, but attempting to gather enough to survive on from the tiny hedges left by modern farming methods is an impossible task.

Grow your own food, keep a well hidden stash to tide you over if your crops fail or are stolen, replenish your stash after each harvest. These methods have worked before, and they'll work again.

Learn about medicines, you won't learn everything, trade some bacon with a doctor who does know.

Of course, this only applies if you manage to leave the towns/cities in time, you're not going to find edible plants in the car park at Tesco.

If I was in the suburbs now I'd be learning as much as possible about farming / growing / livestock and I'd be buying a van and caravan. When TSHTF I'd be off like a shot to the furthest decent land with all my useful kit, which would include a great stock of seeds and gardening books, once there I would be offering my services to a farmer ( average age 59 ) in return for a plot.

It will be a hard life for a while, compared to our current cossetted existence.

Spot on Steve, good post and I agree with fully.

Prior knowledge cannot be undone; infrastructure will largely remain; items can be salvaged etc etc.... we will not end up back in the dark ages, even if we have no fuel; no national power grid etc.

There will also always be some kind of law and order, be it local militia's; elected mayors (not like the current context); the military or just self governed communities.......

[Straight Shooter]

I think the main thrust of johns thread is it will not be a bad thing to learn the skill sets ....you do not have to believe in total collapse if you do not want to ....but if that happened you win ....if it does not happen you still win...what,s wrong with that ? there is no argument at least this is the way i have read it.

[Mortblanc]

(30 November 2014, 22:02)Straight Shooter Wrote: MB i am now wondering WHY? you put up with us and this site? its obvious you feel its not worth any effort to at least give a constructive reply,could well be not worth your time at all...i expected better from you.

I have replied to this BS repeatedly over the months so I must ask if you never pay any attention to any of the good advice I offer?

The population of GB has not been able to sustain itself on the leaves, roots and berries growing in the hedgerows since the last Roman got back on the boat to breathe a sigh of relief and go home.

You have required sustainable agriculture since well before the end of the stone ages and many of your present villages date to that time. That was at the point when your population was less than 1% of what it is today.

No plague, war, famine or desperate waves of mass migration has reduced your population by more than 30% during historic time, so a more than 99% die off is NOT going to happen.

As for why I log on here???

Someone has to try desperately to keep at least a few of you folks from hurting yourselves.

[Straight Shooter]

You would do better to turn your obvious higher intelligence and intellect to more pressing matters of saving the land of the free ...now that is desperate ! MB please don,t worry about us ....as you point out quite correctly we have been about some considerably more time than the land of the free. first , second, forth amendments should be first on your list....there are more but....just sort those first ....when you finish that come back ....i will give you more ...glad to help ....and maybe we can save you from hurting yourselves....have you learnt nothing from our little island....jeez

[CharlesHarris]

I have agree wth Mortblanc.... In an overpopulated island dependent on imports, an interruption of international commerce on the scale which occurred uring WW2 would result in a mass die-off without massive infusions of outside aid.

Famine + overpopulation = cannibalism

[Devonian]

(30 November 2014, 23:03)Straight Shooter Wrote: I think the main thrust of johns thread is it will not be a bad thing to learn the skill sets ....you do not have to believe in total collapse if you do not want to ....but if that happened you win ....if it does not happen you still win...what,s wrong with that ? there is no argument at least this is the way i have read it.

Agreed, but the idea that the only to survive a total collapse (if one were to happen) would be to revert to a nomadic hunter gatherer lifestyle is in itself doomed to failure, in my opinion.

The lack of food to forage/hunt; the presence of other hostile persons; the weather etc would all result in your rapid demise.

Now I'm not saying that hunting, trapping, foraging, skills and also the ability to make your own clothing, medicines and tools are not worthy skills, of course they are, and isn't 'exactly' why we are all here? discussing such issues, stocking kit, practising our skills, learning new things, identifying resources, noting BOL's etc etc??? That is surely what we as preppers do?

But john is suggesting that our 'Prepping Falls Short' and that the ultimate solution is to become a nomadic hunter gatherer utilising traditional skills with no reliance on modern kit, skills, learning or other resources....

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(30 November 2014, 23:32)Straight Shooter Wrote: You would do better to turn your obvious higher intelligence and intellect to more pressing matters of saving the land of the free ...now that is desperate ! MB please don,t worry about us ....as you point out quite correctly we have been about some considerably more time than the land of the free. first , second, forth amendments should be first on your list....there are more but....just sort those first ....when you finish that come back ....i will give you more ...glad to help ....and maybe we can save you from hurting yourselves....have you learnt nothing from our little island....jeez

In terms of a die-off I tend to agree to MB.

Even if you take examples like the Ethiopian famines where you are talking about millions of people living in refugee camps in what is effectively a desert, then even in those circumstances, despite the huge numbers of deaths, the vast majority of the population still survived, so why would the UK be any different, why would our population not survive.

[NorthernRaider]

I think that even the US would struggle to feed itself without Petrochems for fuel and fertiliser and electricity.

[Straight Shooter]

and the total demise of the petrodollar as i type this....not even samson could hold shit back....lack of Coca cola, Dunging Donuts, hot dogs, hamburgers, and Marlborough cigarettes should have a diverse affect on 90% of the USA population ....excluding preppers.... and illegal aliens coming over the boarders who i am told can exist on fly shit indefinitely.

[Steve]

How many people have actually looked into a hedgerow recently ? There isn't very much calorific value in there.

If you bug out with the intention of living from hedgerows you will fail. Don't do it. We have thousands of years of knowledge on how to survive by growing food and raising livestock - you'd be stupid to "forget" all this and try to live like a neanderthal.

We can't eat grass, but Geese can, and we can eat Geese. Or rabbits, sheep, cows. We can't eat earth, but we can eat potatos.

The crash won't wipe our memories or erase our books, so we don't have to live in caves.

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(30 November 2014, 23:09)Mortblanc Wrote: As for why I log on here???

Someone has to try desperately to keep at least a few of you folks from hurting yourselves.

Maybe it's a "clash of cultures", but to my British sensibilities you often come across as a pompous dickhead. That's a shame, because you obviously have a lot to offer.