Where Most Prepping Falls Short:

[Barneyboy]

hope you don't mean sex slave NR,you are the one who thinks he is that gay news reader .just saying

[Devonian]

(1 December 2014, 18:26)bigpaul Wrote: the "die off" is not my invention, it has been remarked and discussed on many prepping and survival blogs and websites, google them and read for yourself. actually without the land available and with no imports we NEED a large die off as we cannot hope to feed everyone(we also need a clear out of the gene pool but that's a separate discussion!) and if no die off we really have got a much bigger problem than if there was one. what about the plague/black death? that wiped out about 40% of the population and we have a larger, more closely packed, more travelled, population these days so infection would spread more easily.

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what about Ebola/Swine flu/Avian flu etc etc?

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[quote='Devonian' pid='87124' dateline='1417453888'

give mankind enough credibility for his ingenuity and resourcefulness to overcome issues.

it wont be the likes of Mr Dyson or Mr Branson hanging around to pick up the pieces after "the collapse", that sort will be long gone along with the politicos to their private islands, what we will be left with will be the "flotsam and jetsam" the dregs of society, the sort that you saw in the Autumn riots of 3 years ago, the sort you see in the Anarchy protests or the sort you see in Furguson USA. I don't know about you DEV but i'll be "bugged out" and hunkered down away from all the idiots and those" mainlining in stupid".
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Don't worry I'm not having a dig at you and I know that plenty of people go on about and discuss the mass die off on various forums and blogs, but that doesn't mean that it will (or won't) happen.

What we need to do is consider what is actually 'realistic' and what is likely to happen, and the easiest way to do this is to look at history and consider what has (or hasn't) happened in the past.

As for ingenuity and resourcefulness, you don't need a Mr Dyson or an Alexander Graham bell. There are lots of electrical and mechanical engineers around; fabricators; mechanics; farmers; and even hobbyists can do and achieve an awful lot.

Take Briggs for example over on UKP, some of the things that he has engineered and developed are pretty impressive and that's just him playing around.

And yes the protesters and anarchists are not the type of people that I'll be having anything to do with either, but going back to John's original point, in that once we get past the initial situation things will be different, and in that context in the longer term, even the protesters and anarchists will soon realise that if they want to survive, they are going to need to pull their fingers out of their arses as well!

(1 December 2014, 19:03)Barneyboy Wrote: wtshtf they will be a good food sauce that's a joke by the way guys I don't mean it the old will be a big help with there smarts that come with age ,and you can make good shoes out of there leathery skin that is a joke again

[NorthernRaider]

Chuckle !!! I'm trying to imagine a " Prepper" commune that has heavy smokers and rabid anti smokers, Capitalists and Socialists, Townies and Yokels, Veggies and Vegans and Pure Omnivores, Bible / Quoran /Torah thumpers plus Pagans and Atheists, Those who want an elected " leader" those who don't, those wanting a committee those who want to be left alone, those who want to make fuel for machinery and those who want to get back to pre petrol days, Those who think everyone should pay into a central fund and those who do not, Tea totallers and boozers, Armed population or disarmed police controlled community.

Personally I think it would end up as a very unhappy place very quickly.

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Barney I don't think there is any fear of me wanting a sex slave unless its Lucy Verasami the weather girl of my dreams, In 2014 I rub on Vic where I used to rub Brut, If I go to a nightclub they offer me a seat and it takes me all night to do what I used to do all night

[Barneyboy]

I think after the first winter ,and some raiders nicking there stuff it will all fall into place NR

[Devonian]

(1 December 2014, 19:23)NorthernRaider Wrote: Overall I think if we did face a societal collapse and we had no oil or imported foods then YES a population reduction is most likely, but I am not certain DIE OFF is the correct way to describe it, a gradual down sizing or gradual contraction in the population would almost be inevitable as the country had to adapt its population and current economic climate to meet its remaining local resources. A gradual decline because of a reduced or quality of diet, and it would be compounded by a die off of those reliant on expensive exotic medications like Insulin if our economy collapses, plus a lack of modern pharmas and other stuff that costs money and is made from oil is likely to reduce life expectancy if not actually killing off people.

Personally I think this is much more realistic and will happen over a period of years, rather than months.

Life expectancy as you say will drop; the weak, ill and elderly will be the first to die and also I think because of our current ethnic diversity in the UK, we may even find that a lot people actually leave the UK, places around the Mediterranean would for example be seriously appealing for many, growing crops would be easier; fishing in the Med is easier and safer that around the UK coast; the climate is warmer etc..... so maybe we will actually see the start of mass migration away from the UK rather than the current mass immigration?

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(1 December 2014, 19:31)NorthernRaider Wrote: Chuckle !!! I'm trying to imagine a " Prepper" commune that has heavy smokers and rabid anti smokers, Capitalists and Socialists, Townies and Yokels, Veggies and Vegans and Pure Omnivores, Bible / Quoran /Torah thumpers plus Pagans and Atheists, Those who want an elected " leader" those who don't, those wanting a committee those who want to be left alone, those who want to make fuel for machinery and those who want to get back to pre petrol days, Those who think everyone should pay into a central fund and those who do not, Tea totallers and boozers, Armed population or disarmed police controlled community.

Personally I think it would end up as a very unhappy place very quickly.

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Barney I don't think there is any fear of me wanting a sex slave unless its Lucy Verasami the weather girl of my dreams, In 2014 I rub on Vic where I used to rub Brut, If I go to a nightclub they offer me a seat and it takes me all night to do what I used to do all night

I'm sure there is probably a Monty Python sketch hidden in there somewhere

[NorthernRaider]

Point of note that Dev made about a possible sign of things to come, Dev referred to the Tottenham riots, I noted that between 450 and 1000 rioters looters etc went beserk that week and for at least 48 hours the Met police numbering some 32,000 officers at that time were withdrawn by their bosses "FOR THEIR OWN SAFETY" That was the official reason to boot. So if we had serious civil unrest say like a modern version of the old GENERAL STRIKES where MILLIONS of workers down tools but unlike the 1930s they did not remain generally peacefully but a 2014 version of huge numbers of pissed off citizens running riot.

1 How would the Police cope
2 How could the govt cope cos with only 82,000 troops they could not control even a 1/4 of the country
3 How far would the economy fall apart and could it recover quick enough to prevent a major national catastrophe.
4 How could we plan and respond

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Barney makes another point many of us would need to consider, Imagine a bad winter, not one as bad as 2010 but a typical real winter with a fair amount of snow, no street lights, no snow ploughs, no food deliveries, no public transport, possible / likely major prolonged power cuts as no one would be running out to fix the wires, no chemists, no doctors, no supermarkets, if the power goes off then for millions the gas goes off as well. Roads closed not for a few days but until spring.

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Barney Moses leading his 40,000 socialists into the wilderness looking for the capitalist promised land to raid and ending up as snow makers

[Devonian]

1 How would the Police cope

Badly, they would need the support of the Military who would I guess would deal with things much more firmly.

2 How could the govt cope cos with only 82,000 troops they could not control even a 1/4 of the country

I think the issue is that the numbers of rioters etc would be relatively small and as seen in Tottenham, I think communities would come together to protect their own property and families.

Also this sort of rioting is normally restricted to the large conurbations/cities

3 How far would the economy fall apart and could it recover quick enough to prevent a major national catastrophe.

In this aspect, if we are talking about a UK only situation, then I think(?) that we could recover quite quickly, a lot of trade is international these days, and dare I say it, but the results of the riots just like previous flooding events would actually create a boom time for builders and tradesmen, both through repairs and rebuilding, and also from others who want to introduce more protection to the their properties...

4 How could we plan and respond

Don't live in Cities


Of course all of the above could be way of the mark

[Oggydoggy100]

What a very well informed article. Most of what you say is true. I have worked in the Heritage Field for over 35 years and started projects in experimental archeaology, mainly Iron Age, Roman and Medieval.

I have had the chance to learn numerous skills from basic flint knapping & metal working to making basic ceramics. I never thought I would ever use this skills outside of the Research Archaeology Field, but hey, you would be surprised how useful these skills are.

Lost my knife once so had no cutting implement, but found some local flint and was able to knapp a very basic cutting tool in around 20 mins, just one example of how ancient skills could be of use to preppers, just requires practice.

[NorthernRaider]

Dev consider this, if we had a nationwide protest like as I mentioned a General Strike and being 2014 it turned nasty, and the army was called out do you think they would be willing to challenge the people from their home towns and counties ???

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The days when if a riot broke out up north the govt would send a southern yeomanry unit to stamp it out is no more, because every army unit is so mixed up they nearly all recruit from anywhere in the UK I don't think many squaddies would be willing to use violence against their own communities, but I could see the lefties asking the EU to send "peacekeepers" to bring a country back under control.

[Straight Shooter]

Well hear we are then...its like this. When i started walking down this road with you all, it was a great place to be,BP NR LS S13 are responsible for my arrival here to this place , i have enjoyed the GIG both highs and low,s and have learnt a lot. MB is not a dickhead or pompous in my eyes he is a guy coming to the end of his time as am i ...thing is with us older ones the natural thing for us is to pass on life experiences to the young and deliver nuggets of hard earned knowledge normally hard got from making mistakes ...in itself this is fraught with pitfalls especially trying to explain stuff in short order ...often its abrupt to the point, we need you to get it fast you see , we want you to get it by any means ...this leads to ....why don,t they get it ....this leads to reinforcement over and over to the point of sheer boredom of having to repeat stuff over and over.....back a bit i posted a thread regarding security for my home ....which went tits up, UKS MB and LS offered their support in less than a hart beat...i never took up these offers....because of other far more pressing family stuff (which i made them aware of) even more support was the result which i am and will be forever grateful a kind word is enough when your down. But problems remain at home ....it is what it is. Respect has to be earned in any endeavour this cannot be bought there are no shortcuts...when MB was getting shot at in nam i was sat watching in the comfort of the 3 up 3 down mid terrace house in south Wales ...years later i visited THE WALL it had the most profound effect on me..and i can,t really explain it even now....i recommend you go have a look yourselves if you ever get the chance. Now enough about Mort ....its 100 US as agreed Mort... today i have spent most of it cleaning the ground...and along with remorse for my reply ...why did i do that ....around and round it went ...why would i write such shit to guy that offers help and support....what is it i do not get ....if i understand so much like i say i do ,i will try to address it ....when you or i read a post the attitude of any given author comes through on a key board.... sarcasm and innuendo become tools to reinforce any given view or augment ...this can and often result of a thread forced off the rails and a rather silly battle of wills that serve no purpose but it makes us feel better ...this is often short lived and reveals a lack of control ...leading to regrets ....the biggest loss in reality is to all who want to participate and moreover people watching this being played out and get a kick out of the proceedings for all the wrong reasons, a loss is the result and no gain leading to lack of posts...threads . As for John he said it in the first few words ....i don,t often post stuff but.........there ..just there .. look where its led ....like many lately, is it no wonder why members are giving up....when they try ,crash and burn is the outcome....newbies what newbies .. i am just as much to blame as anyone else....jokes and whit have carried me far.....its a sort of crutch i have used most of my life...a safety device i rely on this is particularly useful if you don,t know that much....saves time and effort learning to link stuff and post pics you can get away with loads , and the best bit is they don,t know...or do they ?...... nearly there folks...............i will always be a survivalist i have form...try working for yourself for forty odd years...rags to riches to rags ...well not Quite i am still standing, there a lots of things going on in this life of mine some good some not so good but i am getting off here... i am not going to trade insults any more, then regret it , my life is growing ever shorter and i intend to live what,s left to the full given my health right now and do without the shit...i am having a de clutter , and now finally
some Q & A s

Q is it really true you are fucking incredibly drop dead gorgeous and good looking
A fuck yeah

Q is it true NR wanted to look at your huge tits
A fuck yeah ....fucking animal

Q what,s the story with SD and the celery stick
A how the fuck should i know....ask NR you sick bastard !

Q Is it true your going to another site
A NO the prognosis is i am completely cured

Q do you think you will be missed on here
A Are you fucking insane .....of course i will

Q do you think you will miss us
A of course i will you fucking idiot !

Q where do you think the site will end up
A ITS UP TO YOU

Q Is there any legacy you would like to leave here
A yes John Lennon IMAGINE
.....look last question i have to take a piss!

well how do you like that...they just fucked off !

All that remains SD remove me from here when you read this, Thank you for the site i do hope things get better and wish you all good things its up to those who remain and those who want to join a great UK based site ......NR when you get that xmas prezzy toll away and imagine the tits that never was.....henry said hello !! GOOD LUCK. ....and another thing......THWACK !!!!! arrrrgh BP you twart ! " I HATE LONG GOODBYES SS"