Survival UK Forums

Quote:What are you now? A scavenger or a raider?

I would say that it doesn't really matter what we perceive ourselves to be in that situation, what matters is what the person holding the gun perceives us to be, which might well be totally different from our view

(11 October 2011, 11:35)Skvez Wrote: [ -> ]You are neither a raider nor a scavanger.
To be a raider you would be the one with the weapon.
You intended to be a scavanger but ended up being a looter.

,Can you explain the difference to me between looting the scrap yard and
scavenging it for some oil.
In my opinion a looter is an opportunist who knows they are thieving from someone else but does it anyway, a scavenger is someone who sees an opportunity to obtain something from what they percieve to be an abandoned item or place and does so.

.you can now become a traider/barterer to get the oil and leave with your fluids intact.

What have you got to trade/barter? A half filled tin can? Do you think the guy will let you go on the promise to return the following day with some supplies for him? I doubt it.

what I'm getting at here is how easy it is to blur the line between percieved intent, the guy living in the scrap yard thinks you're a thief and you know you were scavenging what you honestly though was an abandoned scrap yard. It's a tricky one.

(11 October 2011, 07:12)sc1 Wrote: [ -> ]A scavenger. Nasty scenario. My family member hiding in the ditch with the crossbow a aimed at this guys head will pull the trigger.

Really?
Your 'moral code' suggests that it perfectly acceptable for your group to murder someone who is only (so far) challenging a trespasser and thief on *their* land.
I hope I never meet you or yours either before or after an event.

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(11 October 2011, 16:30)Reality Jones Wrote: [ -> ]Do you think the guy will let you go on the promise to return the following day with some supplies for him? I doubt it.

Neither do I.
The *best* I can expect from this situation is to applolgise, explain that you weren't aware that the scrapyard was still owned by anyone. Explain that you want the oil and are willing to barter for it. Discuss and agree a price. *Leave the oil* and return at some later date to make the exchange for it.

I love threads like this. No right or wrong answers but it makes people think. The more we think about these things the more prepared we will be if we end up in a similar situation on either side.

(12 October 2011, 10:49)Skvez Wrote: [ -> ]Really?
Your 'moral code' suggests that it perfectly acceptable for your group to murder someone who is only (so far) challenging a trespasser and thief on *their* land.
I hope I never meet you or yours either before or after an event.

It's an extreme scenario that we are unlikely to come across. Consider this though, if you were in that position, scavenging for oil and unarmed and a man, hungry and twitchy appears behind you with a shotgun pointed at you, what would you want to happen? Chances are that someone in that scenario is going to lose their life. Would you rather wait until he pulled the trigger before your group helped you? Of course I don't advocate murder. I was replying to a question about a fictitious scenario and that is one possible outcome. If I was in that situation and my son was covering me from a ditch then it's quite conceivable that he would act once he realised I was in danger. Obviously it's not a desirable outcome. If it's any consolation, I'd kick my son's ass afterwards.

I was considering this scenario from the position of the person who owned the scrap-yard.
If I see someone looting I'm going to challenge them, I'm going to go armed.
I don't want to be shot for doing so.
Given people like you perhaps I should just shoot the looter in the back from my position of concealment.

If you are going to confront someone whilst armed you are bringing it upon yourself. Why would you approach an unarmed person armed with a shotgun?

SC,

How do you know they are unarmed. They may have a handgun, a knife or even their body may be a weapon.Why take a chance?

Fair point. There was no weapon mentioned in the original scenario so I presumed they were unarmed.

It didn't cross my mind to say that the person in the scenario had or didn't have a weapon. But I guess after an event it's going to be highly unlikely that anyone will be walking around un armed.( I know I wont be!)

Skvez. I like yr barter proposition the best, at the very least you may escape with just yr soiled undercrackers. and at best you may have just met a new person that you can exchange goods or food with for a long time to come, securing your survival for a little longer.