fight or negotiation

[bigpaul]

yes...I would, because their probably going to kill me anyway.

[Straight Shooter]

I have doubts, if I was a gang member say 1 of 4 ( that could be sustainable number) your not going to pile straight in to start with, you would survey the pray first look for weak spots even then you might send 1 member in to gather more intel first if you think you stood a chance, even a distraction tactic what ever, if it was 1 or even 2 you my stand a chance if it was more say 4 or 6 I can't see how you could even begin to reason with them, would know your position and its not good , they would just kill you anyway , this post assumes that you have been caught unawares so you have to deal with the situation in front of you NOW, so I will assume I am on my own at this point and the other members of my group are not aware of my situation... first I would hail a warning (planed ) to alert my group, even if it was a nine year old girl ....the next step would be played out by talking or violence , the main thing here is not the individual , its the group, they may well take me out BUT the group would have a bit of time to formulate a plan or follow the plan in place.

[bigpaul]

I really cant see this scenario as a problem for where HL. SS or I live, probably more of a town, city thing, although I wouldn't rule it out completely, I think it would be low of the scale of things.

[Jonas]

(14 June 2013, 14:10)Mortblanc Wrote: This is one of those points where the British and American thought processes go in different directions.

What possibly can be gained by negotiation over supplies you have gathered and you own except the loss of those supplies? My terms are, you go away and I will let you live.

And yes, I will kill to protect myself and my loved ones and the supplies needed to keep them alive. Over here we call it the Castle Doctrine and defense on ones person and family is approved by the government, so far.

"My terms are, you go away and I MAY let you live."

There. I fixed it for you!

[Gizmo]

(18 June 2013, 14:40)bigpaul Wrote: I really cant see this scenario as a problem for where HL. SS or I live, probably more of a town, city thing, although I wouldn't rule it out completely, I think it would be low of the scale of things.

You may be right but i'm not so sure. In the very remote places such as where Highlander lives it may be the case but in places like Devon and Cornwall it could be very different

I was born down there and lived there for many years. I still have lots of family down there so go back frequently. Depending on the time of year there are millions of extra people holidaying in Devon and Cornwall, if tshtf then most of these people would be streaming through the countryside trying to get home.

The main roads down there are gridlocked half the time during the summer now, It would be 10 times worse in a shtf scenario so they would be all trying to avoid the gridlocked main roads and taking routes down the country lanes. I doubt anywhere in Devon would be immune from "visitors" and you cant shoot them all.

Devon is a big county but Dartmoor to the south will channel the vast majority of those travelling into the north of the county, the coast road along the top from Cornwall will be just as gridlocked as the A30 so that will force people down into the countryside

I'm not saying you are wrong, it's just that I used to give the subject a lot of thought when I lived down there and in the end the best I could come up with was that if tshtf I just hoped it wouldn't do it in the summer

[bigpaul]

(18 June 2013, 22:53)Gizmo Wrote:

(18 June 2013, 14:40)bigpaul Wrote: I really cant see this scenario as a problem for where HL. SS or I live, probably more of a town, city thing, although I wouldn't rule it out completely, I think it would be low of the scale of things.

You may be right but i'm not so sure. In the very remote places such as where Highlander lives it may be the case but in places like Devon and Cornwall it could be very different

I was born down there and lived there for many years. I still have lots of family down there so go back frequently. Depending on the time of year there are millions of extra people holidaying in Devon and Cornwall, if tshtf then most of these people would be streaming through the countryside trying to get home.

The main roads down there are gridlocked half the time during the summer now, It would be 10 times worse in a shtf scenario so they would be all trying to avoid the gridlocked main roads and taking routes down the country lanes. I doubt anywhere in Devon would be immune from "visitors" and you cant shoot them all.

Devon is a big county but Dartmoor to the south will channel the vast majority of those travelling into the north of the county, the coast road along the top from Cornwall will be just as gridlocked as the A30 so that will force people down into the countryside

I'm not saying you are wrong, it's just that I used to give the subject a lot of thought when I lived down there and in the end the best I could come up with was that if tshtf I just hoped it wouldn't do it in the summer

yes a lot of people holiday here but they mostly stick to the coasts, I live right in the middle of devon out in the countryside, once you get away from the coasts and the urban sprawl the population drops dramatically, if I had to I could bug out and disappear completely, I expect you wont believe that but that also is a point in my favour.in any case if TSHTF happened in summer wouldn't the tourists all immediately head home??

---

in any case who said I use the MAIN roads? I've said enough times I use back country roads.

[Gizmo]

Quote:in any case who said I use the MAIN roads? I've said enough times I use back country roads.

I know, I was pointing out that as I imagine the 3 main trunk roads will be gridlocked lots of them will be driving round all the back country roads and lanes trying to avoid the jams, the end result being them scattered all around previously quiet areas.

Like I said earlier, I'm not saying you are wrong, who knows for certain until it happens, but it is something that I used to expect to happen when I lived there.

[Straight Shooter]

I suppose the scenario depends a lot on where you live, but the post said you are caught out , does not matter HOW ....but you now have to deal with what's in front of you RIGHT NOW what would you do ? anything is possible no matter how much we prepare NOBODIES infallible .....address in problem......not that easy is it.

[Timelord]

Sunna was talking about when push comes to shove - would you fight? But if you read his whole post through, it actually talks about the possibility of negotiating as an alternative, to attempt to preserve oneself & family. It seems to imply that the odds are not in your favour in the immediate scenario. Just stating that you live in a remote location or that you would see them coming first towards your home does not put your mind in the place of the scenario. Additionally you may not always be at home or may be caught travelling between locations, or horror of horrors someone does unexpectedly pay you a visit. Just saying you would be pre-emptively in charge of the situation and give the strangers the ultimatum or that you live off the beaten track is not dealing with the dilemma posed. It is running the thread off at a tangent. I tried to simplify the scenario in my post to make it easier to follow. So far it is 50/50 who is comprehending the dilemma put forward. There are some very relevant answers and some oft repeated shake offs. This thread scenario is an important dilemma that many preppers have to grapple with, which is why I am pushing this one to keep the debate on the actual points originally raised. Regards, TL.

[Grumpy Grandpa]

(20 June 2013, 00:42)Timelord Wrote: Sunna was talking about when push comes to shove - would you fight?...

...This thread scenario is an important dilemma that many preppers have to grapple with, which is why I am pushing this one to keep the debate on the actual points originally raised. Regards, TL.

I appreciate the value of debating scenarios such as these TL, serving as they do to focus the mind on the 'what if's' of any 'event'. In all honesty though, I find I have nothing further to add to my last response:

Quote:As for the BI/BO choice, I don't have one. I'm not going to get far in my chair, so I can't let outsiders win.

Will I negotiate? I doubt it. It'll be seen as a sign of weakness.

Will I kill to defend me and mine? That's a harder question to answer. For me, a lot will depend on the gravity of the 'event'. If it's likely to be over in a couple of months, maybe taking a life isn't worth it. In that case, my response would depend on what they did but if their actions warranted it, then yes, I would kill and be prepared to take the consequences when ROL returns. (I'm an old git anyway.)

If the 'event' is a doozie then what we have, we need to survive and nobody's getting it.

Either way, I wouldn't take it lightly. Taking anyone's life is as serious as it can get and the act and the responsibility will always stay with you.

That's as honest as I can be...